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Wisconsin, Fox, and Shep Smith's comments

Posted: Apr 20, 2011

I've always liked Sheppard Smith.

He commented on the Wisconsin situation:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/24/shep-smith-wisconsin-figh_n_827547.html

;

I like Sheppard Smith too.... - Indy

[ In Reply To ..]
but I disagree with him completely on this issue. Able to do it without calling him even ONE name. ;)

GOOD for you! I'm proud of you. That's a very good thing. - nm

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

Don't like him anymore. He has become too big for - his britches, tries to act cool, then

[ In Reply To ..]
stutters and stammers while trying to be cool. His views are usually very opinionated, which is fine, but he tends to put down those who disagree. I used to like him a lot, but he has changed. Tone it down, Shep, you are just another person and not as important as you think.

Scott Walker Testifies Before Congress - mbmt

[ In Reply To ..]
Governor Walker even admits that stripping most collective bargaining rights from public employees does not save Wisconsin any money, so what was the reason for attempting to do it other than union busting?

See link below:

http://www.channel3000.com/news/27543355/detail.html

From what I see, he was talking about a - Indy

[ In Reply To ..]
particular part of the law, and not the collective bargaining stripping part..just a requirement for an annual vote by union members to continue union representation. I don't see that as stripping anyone's rights, but insuring that they continue to have choice on an annual basis as to whether they want union representation.

This was the question:

Rep. Dennis Kucinich, D-Ohio, asked: "Your proposal would require unions to hold annual votes to continue representing their own members. Can you please explain to me and members of this committee how much money this provision saves for your state budget?"

Walker replied: "That and a number of provisions we put in, because if you are going to put in a change like that, we wanted to make sure that we protected workers of our state so they had a right to know what kind of value they got out of it."

Kucinich replied: "Can you answer the question? How much money does it save, governor?"

"That particular part doesn't save any," Walker replied.

This was a particular question about an annual vote, requiring the union to have a vote yearly as to whether the members wanted to continue to be represented by the union. That part, yes, doesn't save any money because it has nothing to do with the union bargaining for increases in wages and/or benefits. I don't see anything wrong with members voting annually on whether or not to continue with union representation. The union should not be afraid of that either. If they are continuing to represent their members to their members' satisfaction it should be a slam dunk, right?

After reading the whole article and particularly the part above, I don't agree with your characterization of what took place....so we will agree to disagree on that.

Thanks!

It should not have been part of a budget bill. - but you are okay with it--nm IINO

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Yes, I am okay with it. Why would you - Indy

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not be okay with it? Have you looked at everything included in either of the budget bills in Congress? When you have, then come back and ask me if guaranteeing union members the right to vote on retaining the union yearly is really so bad.

If you are against having union members be able to vote yearly on union representation, so be it, though I have no earthly idea WHY you would be against it, whatever kind of bill it was in.

You do know that all kinds of peripheral stuff gets stuff into all kinds of bills at every level, right?

As a side note, the post was put up originally to insinuate to support that Walker was union busting because limiting collective bargaining rights was not going to save the state money. That is not what the article said at all. Nice attempt at deflection but I still don't understand why you would be opposed to allowing union members to vote on membership on an annual basis, just because it was in a budget bill.

Video and Legislative Fiscal Bureau Report - mbmt

[ In Reply To ..]
Here is the actual video. There is also a copy of the Legislative Fiscal Bureau Non-Fiscal Policy Items Report.

http://democrats.oversight.house.gov/images/stories/FULLCOM/414%20state%20muni%203/LFB%20letter.pdf

http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/dennis-kucinich-gets-gov-scott-walker-admi

Thanks for posting. - Indy

[ In Reply To ..]
I went read the letter and I watched the video. I was not impressed by Rep Kucinich asking questions and not allowing Gov. Walker to answer, basically talking over him and answering his own questions. Not his finest moment in my opinion.

I also think, being a Representative, he knows that nonfiscal things are attached to fiscal bills in Washington almost every single time one is created, so to ask like the legislature in Wisconsin did something the national legislature does not do...oh well. Politics.

That is why I always watch what they DON'T say as much as I watch what they say. There is usually much more information not disclosed than is disclosed and yes I am well aware it happens on both sides of the aisle.

Don't know how they consider limiting collecting bargaining not fiscal though, when pay for state workers comes out of the state budget. Rep Kucinich and the folks who wrote the letter would have to explain that one to me.

Again, thanks for posting!

Actually, the collective bargaining part was separated from the budget bill - mbmt

[ In Reply To ..]
I agree with you that Rep. Kucinich appeared to be a little testy with his questioning. I do think, however, that he was trying to get Governor walker to fess up about the collective bargaining issue. The public employees had already agreed to pay and benefit concessions, but Walker and the Republican senators went ahead and separated the collective bargaining issue from the budget bill, claimed it to be a non-fiscal issue when originally they said it was a fiscal issue, and rammed the collective bargaining part through without the Democrats present.

That being said, collective bargaining is about so much more than pay and benefits. It is also about bargaining for class size, workplace safety, work hours, etc. These things were stripped from public employees in Wisconsin with the exception of police and firefighters. There was really no reason to do that other than for union busting purposes because those things do not affect the budget one way or the other.

Indy, I do appreciate your point of view and thank you for discussing this with me.

Thanks, mbnt! I have learned a lot, and - Indy

[ In Reply To ..]
thank you for helping with that. I also respect your opinion and have enjoyed our discussion.

After reading your post, though, I am more confused than ever about the fiscal nonfiscal thing, who started it, who ended up with it....that is a confusing issue.

I really can't sympathize with the Democrats not being present when the bill was voted in and democracy moved on without them. It was their decision to leave. But, that is the last time that gets mentioned because that poor old horse is long dead and I won't whip him anymore... :).

Just an idea...perhaps if the union would seperate in their collective bargaining contracts the fiscal from the nonfiscal themselves, meaning for class size, work hours, workplace safety, etc., from the bargaining for wages and benefits, these kinds of things could be avoided in the future when there are budget problems. If this was a strong economy I might lean more toward union busting, but in all honesty, I really don't think that was the intention, because the union is not really busted. They retained their members and parts of the members retained their collective bargaining rights, so I don't really see them as busted.

When it all boils down, I see Walker's point about giving workers a choice, that is why he wanted the voting yearly on whether workers want to continue to be represented by a union. I don't see anything wrong with that. I do think unions have allowed themselves to be taken over by people seeking power, otherwise so much of union money would not be funneled into political campaigns. I personally think unions should not be allowed to contribute to campaigns. Union members, yes. Unions as a body, no. I just see too much conflict of interest there.

But, all that being said...I have enjoyed the conversation, I have learned a lot, and I also respect your point of view. Thank YOU as well.

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