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Romney: On Monday it's a penalty, by Wednesday it's a tax.


Posted: Jul 4, 2012

Poor Mitt.  He was born with a silver waffle iron in his mouth.  Proceed with caution.  Readers are at risk for severe whiplash trying to keep up with the contradictions in this piece.  It really gets interesting when he starts explaining why Obama's penalty is a tax and his tax (what he has called it on numerous past occasions when promoting his own plan) is a penalty.  Though he can't even take a stand on his own positions, he does seem to firmly believe the Supreme Court ruled against the Constitution (or does he?), while making it clear his party won't let him say so.  I cannot WAIT to hear him debate this with Obama in the fall. 

WOLFEBORO, N.H. — Mitt Romney said Wednesday that a mandate in President Obama’s signature health-care law is “a tax,” contradicting a position his campaign staked out this week and belatedly getting in line with many other Republican leaders.

The GOP presidential candidate said in an interview with CBS News that he accepts last week’s Supreme Court decision, which upheld the legislation. The law’s individual mandate, which imposes a fine on those who do not obtain health insurance, is a tax, the court ruled, and is therefore constitutional under Congress’s power to assess taxes.

On Monday, senior Romney adviser Eric Fehrnstrom said the former Massachusetts governor rejected the court’s characterization and believed that the individual mandate was a penalty, not a tax.

Although Romney’s comments on Wednesday opened him up to renewed criticism from Democrats that he had changed positions for political expediency, campaign spokeswoman Amanda Henneberg maintained that his remarks “were in line” with what Fehrnstrom said Monday.

Romney said he disagrees with the court’s ruling, and aides said he still thinks the individual mandate is an “unconstitutional penalty,” but he said he accepts that the court’s majority opinion is now the law of the land.

“The Supreme Court has the final word, and their final word is that Obamacare is a tax,” Romney told CBS. “So it’s a tax. They decided it was constitutional. So it is a tax and it’s constitutional.”

Later, Romney said, “While I agreed with the dissent, that’s taken over by the fact that the majority of the court said it’s a tax, and therefore it is a tax. They have spoken. There is no way around that.”

Health-care reform has been a difficult issue for Romney, given the many similarities between the Massachusetts legislation he championed and signed as governor and the federal law that has become one of the most inflammatory issues for conservative voters. The Supreme Court’s ruling made the matter even trickier for Romney.

By saying the mandate is a tax, Romney seemed to acknowledge that the provision in the Massachusetts law that, like Obama’s federal law, fines people who don’t buy health coverage also is a tax. But he argued that is not the case.

Had Romney not called the federal mandate a tax, he would have been at odds with most other Republican leaders in the country, who have seized on last week’s ruling to open a fresh line of attack against Obama and the legislation they call “Obamacare.”

In the CBS interview, Romney signaled that he would campaign on the Supreme Court ruling and he began to brand Obama as imposing new taxes on the middle class.

“They concluded it was a tax, that’s what it is, and the American people know that President Obama has broken the pledge he made. He said he wouldn’t raise taxes on middle-income Americans,” the Republican said.

In his CBS interview, Romney offered reasoning that may prove difficult for many voters to follow.

When correspondent Jan Crawford asked whether his Massachusetts law also is a tax, he said: “The chief justice in his opinion made it very clear that at the state level, states have the power to put in place mandates. They don’t need to require them to be called ‘taxes’ in order for them to be constitutional. And as a result, Massachusetts’ mandate was a mandate, was a penalty, was described that way by the legislature and by me, and so it stays as it was.”

Since his opponents in the 2008 GOP presidential primaries branded him a flip-flopper, Romney has gone to great lengths to try to avoid that label in this campaign. But Obama’s reelection campaign officials saw in Romney’s comments Wednesday an opening, and they rushed out a statement saying that the Republican had “contradicted his own campaign, and himself.”

“First, he threw his top aide Eric Fehrnstrom under the bus by changing his campaign’s position and calling the free rider penalty in the President’s health care law — which requires those who can afford it to buy insurance — a tax,” Obama campaign spokesman Danny Kanner said. “Second, he contradicted himself by saying his own Massachusetts mandate wasn’t a tax — but, Romney has called the individual mandate he implemented in Massachusetts a tax many times before. Glad we cleared all that up.”

Republican strategists said the public debate over whether the mandate is a penalty or a tax will mean little to voters in November.

“I think it means absolutely nothing or less than nothing,” said Alex Castellanos, a top adviser to Romney in 2008 who is no longer affiliated with him. “Whether it’s a tax or a mandate, that’s not what people are going to look at to try and find a difference between these two candidates.”

Greg Mueller, an adviser to conservative groups, said, “Whatever he wants to call it is one thing,” adding: “At the end of the day, Romney’s going to be the candidate ready to repeal — branch and root — Obamacare and stop this massive tax increase, and Obama’s going to be the guy defending it.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/romney-health-care-mandate-is-a-tax/2012/07/04/gJQApL8XNW_story.html

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I can't wait for the debate either - even Obama and other dems - still can't call it a tax.

[ In Reply To ..]
Is it a penalty? Sounds like one, but SCOTUS says it's a tax, so it must be a tax, right? And so Obamacare remains the law of the land as a tax. But if you listen to every dem on any given Sunday morning news show, it's a penalty not a tax. Even those that are celebrating the decision don't know what it is.

The debate will be very interesting indeed - state government versus federal government and Romney will win this debate every time.

I agree - sm

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Obama is not as smart as people think he is. If you don't want to take my word for it read what others have to say. (Others being ones not loyal to any party or from or other countries). He's not that intelligent. Stumbles on his words, and when he gets in a bind it um, er, uh, uh, um, er, uh. He cannot answer questions off the fly. They always have to be prepared ahead of time so he can get the answer and repeat it.

Romney is a smart man. He will win every debate. Guaranteed.

In you dreams! Hahaha! - nm

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In you dreams! Hahaha! - nm - Yeah - we've already seen UR Obama nightmare
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Is this your opinion or are your parroting - Fox or Rush? SM

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Funny how you base intelligence on speech patterns. Do you have any other evidence that would support the thoughts in your post? You know, Obama is not intelligent because.....???

This dem has no problem saying "tax" if that's how - Roberts could uphold the mandate

[ In Reply To ..]

I believe what Chief Justice Roberts said was that the government is authorized to penalize using the tax code. With that in mind, he was then able to affirm constitutionality.  


We all speak English here.  Let's take a look at some definitions from several nonpartisan dictionary sources to see what we find: 


Tax


1.  Dictionary.com:  A sum of money demanded by a government for its support or for specific facilities or services, levied upon incomes, property, sales, etc.  No mention here about nonsupport by disgruntled partisans.


2.  Oxforddictinoaries.com:  a compulsory contribution to state revenue, levied by the government on workers' income and business profits, or added to the cost of some goods, services, and transactions.  Close, but not quite.  In this case, since the assessment is for nonpayment, it is not being added to any costs born by the violator


3.  Wiki.org:  a financial charge or other levy upon a taxpayer (an individual or legal entity) by a state or the functional equivalent of a state such that failure to pay is punishable by law.  Wiki goes into great detail about what kinds of taxes (and their subgroups) are collected, e.g. income, social security, payroll/workforce, property, goods and services, and tariffs.  While health care falls under the category of services, tax is only applied to services rendered, not services never received.  Nope.  ACA specifically forbids money collection via levy, lien or imprisonment, so there is no punishment enforcement for failure to comply with payments owed by ACA violators.  


Penalty


1. Dictionary.com:  1)  a punishment imposed or incurred for a violation of law or rule.  2)  a loss, forfeiture, suffering, or the like, to which one subjects oneself by nonfulfillment of some obligation.  Yep.  That's more like it.


2.  Oxforddictinoaries.com:  a punishment imposed for breaking a law, rule, or contract.  Ditto.  ACA is a law, and money owed is for noncompliance. 


3.  Wiki.org:  Among numerous subcategories of penalties Wiki provides, the one that applies here is the concept of "sanctions"  which it defines as "penalties or other means of enforcement used to provide incentives for obedience with the law, or with rules and regulations."  Bingo.


While insisting that the only definition that matters is the one that is most expedient in promoting a partisan agenda may feel all warm and fuzzy, it does nothing the change these cold, hard facts.  CJ Roberts did his job when he interpreted CONSTITUTIONAL LAW, but his ruling did not change the conventional definitions or meanings of these two words.  To make everyone happy, we could COMPROMISE and call it a penalty tax (but not a tax penalty), inferring the penalty is collected by the authority of the tax system under the Constitution.  Oh wait, CJ Roberts already said that, didn't he?  I think we can all agree that SCOTUS does have the proverbial "last word" in this matter, regardless of how we would like to spin it for partisan campaign purposes. 

Right. It's a silly roil over irrelevancy. National healthcare - costs money, the nation pays up,

[ In Reply To ..]
whatever the bill we receive is called or however the payments are gathered.

Excellent post and explanation. Hope the - Fox viewers get it NM

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x

What really matters is the fact that repubs - keep saying this is SM

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a MASSIVE tax increase (as noted in the OP) and the *** masses are believing this. It is a penalty that will be placed upon those who do not sign up for health insurance and only about 1% of citizens will be effected. The irony is that in the health care bill, it is stated in 2 different places that this penalty will not be enforced. TWO different places in the bill. This is really a nonissue but the repubs are lying to people that this will be a MASSIVE tax increase on the middle class. What really matters is what the SC did regarding the medicare part of this bill. States have the ability to opt out on that now. Several governors have said they will opt out, even though the federal government will subsidize 100% of it for the first few years and then 90%. At the current time, the government subsidizes 57%. Those people now on medicaid and those who would quality for this in the health care bill in states who choose to not do this will now suffer for it. This is what should be discussed, not this bogus tax versus penalty versus mandate nonsense. It's just a talking point for the repubs who know that the people they are trying to persuade are not the kind of people who actually try to find the facts, their facts come from sound bites. I find it sad that so many in this country are so easily manipulated.

Wrong - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
They are saying its a tax because IT IS A TAX on the middle income. And the *** masses want to believe its a penalty and they are trying to convince others it's a penalty. Sorry, when my taxes go up it's a tax. When my premiums go up to pay for others that won't it's a tax. Plain and simple. Obama has just placed the highest tax hike in all of America's history on us. Even Obama said it was a tax. That is until he was told it wouldn't pass if he called it a tax.

And what's worse is he is now forcing people to buy a product they don't want. If I don't want to buy something i don't want or can't afford or don't need I don't want to be told I have to buy it whether or not I need it.

But no, we now have the crats lying to the people that this is a penalty when in all truth IT IS A MASSIVE TAX ON THE MIDDLE INCOME. We are now going to be taxed higher to give something to someone else. People are smarter than you would like them to be. We know what is going on. We are not the *** masses you speak of, but instead the *** masses are the ones trying to lie to people thinking they've been dumbed down enough they won't know the truth.

The huge tax increase just imposed on the middle income in America under the democrats SHOULD be discussed. Especially before election time. You cannot just sweep this under the rug hoping people will quickly forget just in time for the election. This huge tax increase needs to be brought up over and over and over so it remains fresh in everyone's minds that like past democrat leaders, vote them in and you will be taxed way out of your league.

The facts are in the bill. The facts are what Obama first said himself. It's a tax. The facts are what the SC judge said - it's a tax. Facts are facts no matter how much you don't want them to be. More people are reading the bill. More people are doing research. More people are realizing someone is trying to pull the wool over their eyes.

It's a tax on the middle income whether or not you want to believe it.

Do you have health insurance? If so,you will pay no - penalty/tax. nm

[ In Reply To ..]
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WRONG is you - MTFISH

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What you need to remember is this is NOT the democrats plan for healthcare. Their plan is Medicare for all. What was just upheld by SCOTUS is the REPUBLICAN plan for healthcare...glad it was upheld, but it is a convoluted mess of a product, not the simplistic and fair way...so your real issue lies squarely with the REPUBLICANS for passing this hot mess to begin with and taking single-payer system off the table. And if you decide to come back at me with "states rights" I think we can all agree under these tea party governors that states rights are not the way to go either as they also leave in their wake nothing but convoluted messes that we the people will have to clean up.
(I think this is such an interesting point) - ~nm
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Wrong: You are wrong. It is a tax only on - those who do not SM

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participate, not a tax on the MIDDLE CLASS and it is not massive.

You said "And what's worse is he is now forcing people to buy a product they don't want. If I don't want to buy something i don't want or can't afford or don't need I don't want to be told I have to buy it whether or not I need it."

Really? I can't imagine that a lower middle class or poor family wouldn't want to have health insurance especially since they will be given vouchers or even receive medicaid, depending on their financial status. If you don't want it, don't participate then, the "tax" is not enforceable as stated in the AHA. What I don't understand is why you would want US to pay for YOUR medical bills if you need to be hospitalized or are in an accident. Are you okay with that? BTW, that is what is happening now with the uninsured, the insured are paying for them with higher premiums. Your post makes no sense to me at all.

Massive tax increase will take effect - in 2014.

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That might be why some people are not worried, since the tax is not immediate. Believe you me, though, that tax is coming and it will hurt the middle class most.

Your opinion, not fact. - nm

[ In Reply To ..]
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2014 it is - O ye of little research
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Google it, Bing it, whatever. 2014 is the date. Not opinion at all; it's the law.
2014 it is - O ye of little faith. - nm
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Your opinion, not fact. - nm - NO POST, NO LINK, NO RESEARCH, NO CREDIBILeftITY
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Tax (aka penalty) will not be enforced? - No way.

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Hardly a nonissue. Otherwise, why is it even included in the bill?

The masses are being enslaved by - Economic slavery and are so busy drooling

[ In Reply To ..]
over all the "free stuff" they THINK they're getting. What a sorry bunch of politically inept.

Obama moves his lips, he's lying - "I find it sad that so many in this country&q

[ In Reply To ..]
are so easily deceived, incapable of thinking for themselves and are willing to lock-step behind Commie Obammie...too much like Hitler and his regime.

Who exactly are you quoting or are these your - words? SM

[ In Reply To ..]
Anyone who uses the words commie obammie shows they have little knowledge of what is happening in this country and in Congress in particular. What a shame.

Romney: On Monday it's a penalty, by Wednesday it's a tax. - What kind of leadership is th - Far better than Imperial Wizard lack of leadership

[ In Reply To ..]
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Call it what it is... - It's a tax penalty.

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Mitt is right by saying it's both!!

Amazing how so many of - Trigger Happy

[ In Reply To ..]
are all up Romney's hind quarters for stating it was a penalty and then it was a tax. What kind of leadership indeed....Obama said it was a penalty but had his lawyer present it as a tax to the supreme court and is now adamantly stating it is a penalty even though the supreme court ruled it a tax. If you have a problem with Romney's leadership, why don't you have a problem with Obama's? Seems to me like neither of them can determine whether or not it is a penalty or a tax. Personally, I feel if the supreme court ruled it a tax...it is a tax and that makes Obama a liar as far as not taxing those making less than 250K. Again...such wonderful leadership from Obama....and yet you ignore that and go after Romney...lol Double standards yet again...wow. Obama does not wrong yet again even though his lies are blatant and obvious...still many are too blind to see it. Sad really.

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