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Poll of NRA members shows 74% support
Posted: Dec 15, 2012
Not much lower than 82% for the general population, but definitely MUCH higher than the NRA leadership. I've forgotten the number, but most NRA members, normal citizens who undergo them themselves, actually believe gun purchases require background checks.
Although the Brady law requires background checks be conducted by commercial gun dealers, at least 40% of gun sales (last study 15 years old) are private sales not involving background checks. (BTW, eBay and Craig's List do not allow sales of most weaponry.)
Not all background checks are equal, some not so good, but "...states with specific checks for restraining orders, fugitive status, mental illness and misdemeanors, which are considered more comprehensive checks, are associated with a 7 percent reduction in homicides and a 2 percent reduction in suicide deaths. Also, firearm homicide deaths are 13 percent lower when states have checks for restraining orders and 21 percent lower when fugitive status is checked." What states wouldn't require background checks for people with restraining orders on them and fugitives, not to mention the mentally ill? Apparently a bunch.
Most guns used in mass murders were legally purchased.
;
background checks don't mean anything... - there was nothing in this shooter's
[ In Reply To ..]background to even "suggest" an occurrence like this. Background checks cannot detect mental instability, or someone's emotional conflicts that would lead to something like what happened in CT. Background checks will not prevent these occurrences from happening.
If more comprehensive background checks dropped - the homicide rate 7%, that's nothing? Note
[ In Reply To ..]the "more comprehensive." That's not comparing to no background check at all.
Now, how on earth can you argue that background checks that would , for instance, turn up people with court orders to stay away from people they're threatening to kill, are "nothing at all"? Basic common sense should clue you in, even before you googled and found incontrovertable evidence that states that require them have significantly lower homicide rates than those that do not.
Background checks are not meaningless. - LeonaG
[ In Reply To ..]When I buy a gun from a licensed dealer, I fill out the form linked below, and the dealer does a check on the phone to make sure I am who I say I am, have no felony convictions or charges, am not under a restraining order, have not been adjudicated mentally defective, am not an illegal alien, etc.
People ARE caught by this process and denied the gun - at licensed dealers.
Addendum: It has been reported in some places that the shooter tried to buy a gun at a dealer and was denied because he wasn't old enough.
Wingnut Huckabee - already blaming the
[ In Reply To ..]victims of this tragedy for not having enough prayer in the schools.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/14/mike-huckabee-school-shooting_n_2303792.html
This guy can't keep a lid on it for a couple days while the country processes? I guess the Phelps clan will be boarding the buses tomorrow.
*Shakes head in disgust.*
An international expert on teaching soldiers to kill - (instead of shooting over the enemies heads),
[ In Reply To ..]says TV and video game culture parallels the training we give the kids who enter the military. Our entire nation is much more willing to kill than it used to be.
During the Vietnam War the military started studying how to overcome the problem it had that society--and nature--made people unwilling to kill, even on the battlefield when their own lives were in danger. In prior wars, the majority of soldiers actually shot only to keep the others from shooting at them, and typically avoided hitting them even when they could. (Think of video games and movies today with their routine head shots and sprays of blood.) We've learned a lot over the years, which we applied deliberately in training our soldiers. Not deliberate is what we're doing to our children in the process of keeping them quiet and occupied, and to ourselves.
BTW, Huckabee's not just limited in his outlook, there's a dark mind behind that nice face. He's believed to be an authorian leader, whose apparent belief that God is on his side does not offset his character flaws but enables them. In this case, he sells what brings him money and power. And no doubt following it'll salve the consciences of many who find dropping their kids off at Sunday school easy but carefully editing their children's TV viewing, or even turning the TV off, too much work.
Excellent. Wouldn't change a single word. - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Funny - often the whackos that come unglued and - murder people are the religious whackos.
[ In Reply To ..]And that doesn't even begin to take into account the thousands of people in other countries that are killed every day in the name of religion.
Can't believe you - Rolling eyes
[ In Reply To ..]Just shut up and let's mourn the victims for awhile. I know this is not much to many except a platform to scream about banning guns, but have some compassion for a little while.
Umhm. Go live your own words. For me, I'm not interesting in - marinating in tears over the children and
[ In Reply To ..]weeping myself ill over them. Nor will I be hanging on news coverage trying to get closer to the whole thing, watching parents scream and weep at the news, etc., etc., or the inevitable interviews to come, asking parents, "What did it feel like to learn your child was dead?" I'm a mother with grandchildren in elementary school now, and that sort of thing is definitely for others.
What are you interested in then besides your platform ranting and raving?? - Rolling eyes
[ In Reply To ..]I'm a mother too, and it's harsh that 10 minutes after the news broke people are screaming about gun control, as if that agenda matters more than the lax enforcement of already-existing gun laws.
exactly... - I was harshly criticized
[ In Reply To ..]yesterday for posting an article about someone taking advantage of this horrible incident to promote and politicize gun control which I felt was appalling! It was not the time or place to take advantage of the situation to promote one's own agenda in regards to that. I ended up apologizing publicly because I was not intending to promote or politicize anything, but I was accused of it. Now others are doing the exact same thing, as well as declaring that they have no compassion for the dead or the families who lost their precious children. That is just cold hearted!
GUNS DO NOT KILL PEOPLE....PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE! Guns are only the instruments used to carry that out. Knives kill people too, so are you going to ban knives?? Basically anything can be used as a weapon against a human being if someone wants to take that person's life badly enough. Control the person, not the instrument!
While it's true that knives kill people... - ggt
[ In Reply To ..]...they don't kill on a large scale like guns can. Yesterday some lunatic in China went crazy and stabbed 22 school children with a knife. All 22 survived. We can't say that about the kids in Newtown CT who were gunned down yesterday, can we?
The fact is, we are a country that needs more regulation of firearms. We are in the company of 3rd-world countries when it comes to the percentage of firearm deaths, while other 1st-world industrialized nations with stricter gun laws have drastically lower percentages of deaths from guns. When someone's right to own a semiautomatic firearm trumps the right to public safety, there's a big problem.
Control the person, not the instrument. - Really?
[ In Reply To ..]How do you propose to enforce that magic-bullet/single-faceted solution? How do we go about identifying which persons to control and which ones we don't? Why not try EVERYthing instead of one thing, which effectively is tantamount to doing nothing at all?
If you have been following any coverage at all outside the Fox bubble, you will realize by now how complex this problem really is. The three major components involve gun control reform, mental health and a culture of violence, with a whole host of subcategories to list under each one. So far, just off the top of my head, from what I see, under current discussion are:
Gun Control:
1. Renewal of the assault weapons ban that expired 8 years ago, and currently is buried under a heaping pile of more pressing "priorities" in the House as defined by John Boehner. Don't even get me started.
2. More effective background check enforcement, already under discussion here on the forum. This involves beefing up standards/criteria and addressing the lack of uniformity. Of no small consequence is the lack of funding issue that has resulted in a non-computerized PAPER database (restraining orders, criminal and mental health histories), housed in boxes and COLLECTING DUST in the basements of law enforcement and mental health facilities.
3. Much needed focus on the regulation of ammunition sales.
Mental Health:
1. Arcane stigmatization that keeps those affected locked in the closet and shrouded in secrecy.
2. Access to affordable diagnostic and treatment services.
3. Naturally, insurance coverage issues. Inextricable from this problem is the domination of treatment protocols by Giant Pharma that places thousands of high-risk patients on mind-numbing meds, which some of them use to commit suicide, but takes a very restrictive approach to covering a litany of more effective clinical measure. Cognitive and behavioral therapies come to mind.
4. Ryanesque decimation of mental health funding.
5. The criminalization of mental health in support of the prison-industrial complex, where patients are housed and fed, but receive virtually no treatment. Personally, I think this provides a very fertile breeding ground for high recidivism rates as afflicted and non-afflicted populations routinely intermingle and share criminal and pathological mindsets with one another.
Culture of Violence. I doubt this needs further definition, other than to say it emanates from every quark, baryon, meson and hadron of social/broadcast media and entertainment universes. An enhanced educational approach involving anti-bullying and nonviolent conflict resolution has been suggested, along with a health dose of developing the ability to distinguished between the virtual- and real-world applications.
Suffice to say, there will be no magic bullets. Not this time.
A knife cannot mortally wound 26 people in 10 minutes, a gun can. nm - oldtimer
[ In Reply To ..].
Yep. Knives also do not have - 2nd amendment protections that
[ In Reply To ..]give rise to powerful DC lobbies, superfunded by ardent supporters, whose control over legislative process has reached monumentally mindless proportions. I take no issue with its military origins and support their gun safety and sport initiatives, training programs, and competitions. However, its political arm SUCKS now that money, power and greed has taken its toll. It has been ranked by members of Congress as the nations's most powerful lobby, unbelievably more powerful than AIPAC. The grisly results are now plastered all over television and computer screens across the globe.
Hopefully, their day of reckoning is just around the corner.
Foolish and ignorant response regarding intrinsic - danger. See post. nm
[ In Reply To ..]x
Not the OP, but please note the following shouting caps: - My reACTion, along with
[ In Reply To ..]many others (including the OP), is at least in part predicated on personal experience. Perhaps you've never had a gun held to your head by a criminal or a crazed abusive spouse. Neither have I, but I was stabbed by my ex-husband, who had the knife aimed at the left side of my chest. Prior to that, in the five years I had been married to him, I never saw any evidence of violent tendencies.
Thanks to the fast actions my brother (and personal hero) took, who fortunately was nearby, he was just barely able to deflect the aim while I shielded myself by putting my hands and bent arms up in front of my torso. The result was a through-and-through penetrating ripping injury to my left elbow that required 38 stitches. My brother was able to redirect the original front-to-back trajectory in a side-to-side direction by grabbing him by the wrist and twisting it. When the penetration occurred, my elbow was positioned directly over my heart, which left no doubt in my mind about his ultimate intent.
The incident occurred over a long Thanksgiving weekend. The following Jan 3, I filed for divorce. Needless to say, my ex went into hiding. When I packed up his stuff to send to his parents, I discovered a couple of handguns he kept buried in the back of his closet, stashed inside a pair of fishing waders, that I NEVER KNEW he had. Needless to say, had he been packing the day he stabbed me, I wouldn't be here to tell this story.
I was much more fortunate than so many other folks across the country who are now reliving similar traumas. Within the space of less than 10 minutes, I saw two of them on TV today. One was Rep Carolyn McCarthy, R-RI, whose husband was killed and son was severely injured in the 1993 Long Island train station shooting, and another politician whose name I didn't catch who had witnessed a murder as a 9-year-old. He was in tears and having a difficult time gaining his composure, explaining that he had tried to block the incident and rarely talked about it.
You can roll your eyes to your heart's content and join the partisans that would have us all believe we are utterly helpless to do anything to fight back against this NRA/wingnut insanity. That's your prerogative, but HOW DARE YOU minimize, belittle and dismiss those of us whose life's experiences send us down a different path?
Very glad you're around to tell that story, ReACTion. Some mistake - showing grief for actually feeling it. nm
[ In Reply To ..]x
TY for the kind words. Appreciate that. - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
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