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A Must Read for those curious

Posted: Nov 30, 2010

"the rich pay 85% of taxes" thing we keep hearing. ;

Rebuttal.... - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
Myth â�� The Rich Donâ��t Pay Their Fair Share
Perhaps one of the most common myths (or lies, depending on how you look at at it), is the idea the â��rich donâ��t pay their fair shareâ��. But is this true? Various groups drag out â��studiesâ�� to prove their point, but are they correct? Instead of using biased â��studiesâ�� (from any group), why not simply go to the source? The Federal Government published a CBO Paper in August 2004 titled Effective Federal Tax Rates Under Current Law, 2001-2014. On Table 2 (page 18 of the PDF) â��Effective Federal Tax Ratesâ�� under â��Share of Total Federal Tax Liabilitiesâ�� heading shows some interesting results.

Taxes paid by highest incomes
â�¢The top 1% pay 22.7% of taxes.
â�¢The top 10% pay 50% of taxes.
â�¢The top 20% pay 65.3% of taxes.
â�¢The top 40% pay 84.3% of taxes.
Taxes paid by lowest incomes
â�¢The bottom 20% pay 1.1% of taxes.
â�¢The bottom 40% pay 6.1% of taxes.

The bottom 40% pay about 6% of taxes, while the top 40% pay about 85% of taxes â�� or about 14 times more than their counterparts in the lower brackets.

But in light of the constant droning â��the rich donâ��t pay their fair shareâ��, how many expected the distribution reported in the CBO paper? Be honest.

Progressive taxation is not inherently wrong, but taken too far itâ��s socialist income redistribution, which is legalized theft. Asking one minority group to shoulder the burden almost exclusively is discrimination and unethical. Those blessed financially have an obligation to help others, but when the top 40% pay almost all the taxes, isnâ��t that enough?

Charity is a foundational principle, and those blessed financially should help those less fortunate. Everyone should pick a favorite charity and contribute to it regularly. Note: if you do plan on beginning charitable donations, be vary careful, some â��charitiesâ�� use the majority of funds (well over half) for administration. Do some research about your chosen organization and be sure your donations are being used for what you intended. As a very general rule, if administration and fundrasing are more that 10-15%, weâ��d question that organization carefully and thoroughly before sending money.

Do the rich pay enough in taxes?
Everyone has a stake in needs and functions of government, so everyone should pay. Once youâ��ve removed huge sections of people from paying anything, what incentive do they have to demand controlled spending? None. After that, theyâ��ll always vote for the candidate who gives them the most handouts â�� after all, theyâ��re not paying for it. Consider the following comment about democracy:

It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largess of the public treasury. From that time on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury, with the results that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. (This quote has been attributed to both Sir Alex Fraser Tytler and Alexis de Tocqueville.)

So for those who believe the rich donâ��t pay their â��fair shareâ��, how much is enough? If you designed the tax system, who would pay what? With the top 40% shouldering 85% of the burden, how much more would you ask them to pay? And how many in the lower brackets would you exempt? Or do those claiming the rich donâ��t pay enough really want socialist income redistribution? Weâ��d really like to know.

Don't really know why we are arguing about this....lol - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
people who make more are going to be taxed more. Common sense. We can post data all day from all over the place with differing views...but the point is, with the threshold set at $250,000 a year, that puts a lot of people who are not really "rich" in the "rich" bracket. The letter posted by the first poster says that a lot of people at that lower end he would not consider "rich." Frankly, I would not either. I consider Ted Turner, Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, etc., as RICH. $250,000 is chump change to those people. If they want to tax the rich more, then move the bracket up on people like Buffet and Gates who say they should be paying more. Give them their wish and leave the small and mid size businesses alone so maybe they will be able to hire again.

It's not rocket science. And even if they tax the "rich" more starting at $250,000, it will take YEARS for it to have any effect on the debt...and they want to continue to SPEND. So what next? Another tax hike next year on the "rich?"

I repeat, WHY can't we try CUTTING some programs and CUTTING spending? Why raise taxes on ANYBODY?

Doesn't ANYBODY have an answer to that? Can we stop the class warfare and blaming the rich long enough for someone to tell me why we can't at least TRY that?

And an incredibly poor - one at that

[ In Reply To ..]
Where's the link? Looks like the same info Mr. Stives used.

Possibly is the same info and supports what I said... - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
that the rich as defined by the Democrats pay 85% of the taxes paid. Obviously the more money you make the more taxes you pay.

I guess you don't want to answer the question about why not cut costs and control spending instead of raising taxes on anybody either.

lol.

Okay, why not? Now, back to - reality

[ In Reply To ..]
We could sit here all day long and say what they should do. I am frankly not against cutting costs, I'm just tired of all the misinformation being strewn around.

I would rather not converse with you at any "rate." :P

Then I would stop posting misinformation if I were you... - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
and if you want to not converse with me, the smart thing to do would not be answering my posts. And as my mom used to say...keep that tongue in your mouth, it's nasty ;)

Sam, I appreciate your posts and your looking up - of information.

[ In Reply To ..]
You are very informative, and I have learned a lot from your posts. I do not find you to be rude. No more rude than people who have even posted to me who do not agree.

Thanks for your support! I do appreciate it. nm - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

Sam...Just stop talking to them. - Let them talk to each other.

[ In Reply To ..]
then they will get all the answers they want, can pat each other on the back about how smart they are and we aren't, and never ever have to think about something important to say. Let them get the attention and validation they crave from each other.

Thanks for the bucket of cold water..... - voice of reason

[ In Reply To ..]
and you are right. Thanks for the post!

Points taken. Thanks for the posts! nm - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

I agree with the above post - I appreciate your research - Evil Republican

[ In Reply To ..]
You certainly do a lot more research than I do, and when you post something you know the facts. I have also seen you post a message if you are wrong about something (something rarely seen here). Sometimes you discuss topics that go over my head and I have little knowledge about. Kind of makes me feel like I need to read more (oh yeah, whenever I get that "free time") ha ha. But I do join in on topics I am familiar with and always enjoy reading what you write.

Sounds like your mom and my mom would have been good friends. She gave me excellent advice throughout the years along the same lines it looks like your mom gave you. LOL

I enjoyed this thread. Glad you posted the facts about what the rich really do pay in taxes. And I find you very reasonable to have a discussion with even if we don't agree on certain topics.

Thanks for posting.

Thank you for the post. And I believe you are right.... - sam

[ In Reply To ..]
I believe our moms would have been great friends. I think you and I would probably be good friends too...good friends can disagree and leave it at that. I can see us at the local donut shop visting and while we might end up throwing donut holes at each other once in awhile, (lol) it would be great conversation!

Have a good one today!

LOL - I can definitely see us doing that - Evil Republican

[ In Reply To ..]
I LOVE donut holes (chocolate's my favorite), and yes I'd throw some at you. (you must be my evil twin) Mwahahahaha.

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