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Learned something about Reid today

Posted: Dec 19, 2012

http://freedomslighthouse.net/2012/12/18/democratic-senate-majority-leader-harry-reid-in-2010-extolled-the-virtues-of-guns-i-carried-a-gun-every-place-i-went-but-for-me-guns-are-more-than-that-about-self-defense-video-2010/;

Biden, too. From ABC News: - he's a gun supporter

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In an out-of-nowhere attempt to re-assure a southwestern Virginia labor crowd about gun owners’ rights, Biden — who regularly scores “F” ratings from the National Rifle Association — warned Obama that if “he tries to fool with my Beretta, he’s got a problem.”

“I guarantee you Barack Obama ain’t taking my shotguns, so don’t buy that malarkey,” Biden said Saturday at the United Mine Workers of America’s annual fish fry in Castlewood, Virginia. “Don’t buy that malarkey. They’re going to start peddling that to you.”

Biden told the crowd that he himself is a gun owner. “I got two,” Biden said, “if he tries to fool with my Beretta, he’s got a problem. I like that little over and under, you know? I’m not bad with it. So give me a break. Give me a break.

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2008/09/oh-that-joe-n-9-2/

What??!! Dianne Feinstein, too? - How can that be?

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As seen on C-SPAN in 1995!

This shouldn't surprise anyone, except the kind of person who - believes his own propaganda, of course. Over

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the years all of you surely must have known a bunch of Democrats or libs who owned guns, since, according to a 2011 Gallop poll, about FORTY PERCENT of Democrats did at that time.

DF was the 1st to discover Mayor Moscone and Harvey Millk's bodies - when they were assassinated in

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by a political opponent in San Francisco's City Hall chambers. They were shot in the chest and the head multiple times, so one can only imagine her horror, as the two men were her friends and fellow local reps. Feinstein was serving as the city's first woman Board of Supervisors president, which made her 3rd in the line of succession behind Mr. Milk. Gun violence propelled her onto the political stage in ways she never planned. She served as mayor for 10 years before going to DC.

She has dedicated her entire national career to this cause. Judging by the absence of a link to the C-SPAN statement, it would be logical to conclude that whatever this post is trying to convey has been taken out of context and spun up-side-down.

She gave plenty of clues - sm

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C-SPAN - 1995 - Dianne Feinstein. Easy enough to research. If you're really interested in checking the context, that is.

For what purpose? Feinstein's devotion to this cause and - her legislative actions

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form an incontrovertible body of evidence on where she stands on this, regardless of whether or not she may or may not own a gun. Why would anyone waste their time researching such inconsequential arguments to the contrary from decade before last?

Good history, but of course she hasn't devoted her - entire career to gun control. Way off. nm

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x

Well, as you know, there were no assault weapons - sm

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shown in the photos nor did anyone advocate the use of such killing machines.

There's a black and white line here, and everybody knows it: It's the assault weapons, which is what Reid and Feinstein, etc. are against and with good reason.

All guns are assault weapons, - when you really think about it.

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Wouldn't you agree?

Yes, duh. - semantics

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But you know what the poster meant. You can distract with semantic arguments all day long, but the point remains the same.

Please see message. - sm

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I suppose you have a point, but it's the KIND of weapon the person wishes to purchase. A handgun, a rifle for hunting, etc., is okay, but an automatic or semiautomatic weapon (with exploding bullets) IMHO, should be illegal. I can't think of anyone I know that uses assault weapons to kill deer.

How many more little children must die in order to keep the NRA happy?

Reply to All guns are assault weapons - Just Me

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Well, not exactly. "Exploding bullets" as you call them come in all calibers. This means a little 22 can have those bullets that cause excessive damage. A 223 is like a "glorified" hunting rifle and yes, some use them to hunt varmints that kill or injure livestock. You could use one to hunt with and some do. I believe the NRA is a good place. Check out their programs for safety and youth. Really, go to their site and read about it before you judge. At issue here is the lack of a reliable mental health program and follow-through and the need for in-house police officers with weapons training and security issues. Security these days unfortunately is a serious and full time job for real professionals.

THAT semantic would work well for anyone who wanted to - outlaw all guns. Is that you? :) nm

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x

Posted on another thread, but reposted - as it seems appropriate here:

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Clackamas mall shooter faced man with concealed weapon

"Last week 22-year-old Nick Meli was inside the mall shopping with his concealed Glock. Nick Meli ‘responded first,’ and had the active shooter in his cross hairs. It appears Nick may have thwarted the assassin from further kills...."

http://www.kgw.com/home/Clackamas-man-armed-confronts-mall-shooter-183593571.html

Well it would be nice to HOPE there is a concealed gun carrier - somewhere in a mall or schoo, but sm

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There are all kinds of glory stories about someone legally carrying a concealed weapon and coming to another's aid who is facing a gunman. Maybe no one gets shot. Maybe only 20 people instead of 30 end up dying. Sorry, but I really don't like those odds.

I am personally all for a ban on guns with an original design to kill people in combat quickly and in quantity, AR 15's, AK 47's, M16's, etc. These weapons are not for the purpose of hunting, sport, or even self-defense. They belong in military armories under lock in key!!!

Typically, in the past, most of these types of killings have happened to unsuspecting adults. That is not bad enough? People, we have played Russian roulette with the lives of our children for far too long, and now we are losing. We have no excuse anymore. It used to be that when men went off to war on troop trains, you wondered how many would come back. Now, it is our children on school buses. So, NRA save your breath and come up with a better apologetic. When it comes to semi-automatic weapons, your dog doesn't hunt here anymore. Stop using the second amendment as an excuse or reason. We need to be responsible adults here and admit that these weapons were not what our forefathers had in mind.

Government and church have to remain separated. That is how we attempt a civilized society. There is religious freedom for every person in this country already. People who do not know God will not pray, so do not blame the schools. That is not their job. There are mental health clinics all over the place whose patients are probably safer than crazies walking the street, because they sought help for whatever reason.

What is our responsibility as Christians? If you are not Christian, what is your responsibility as an American citizen? What is your responsibility as a parent? This is what we need to figure out. Status quo should not stand anymore. We have to do something as a first step to solving this problem. We need to figure this out as a nation and move forward as quickly as possible.

We have a responsibility as Christians

sorry, did not finish above post - see message

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I would have finished by saying, we have a responsibility as Christians, as athiest, as Jews, as Americans, as adults, as parents. We have to protect our children. This should be our first priority. The NRA will hold a news conference later this week. Do not let their scare tactics lead us back to status quo. What we are doing is not working.

Dislike all you want, and you know who you are, but - read message

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It's time we cowboy-up as a nation!! We need new gun laws immediately, and ANY politician, regardless of party, who votes against it, or cowers to the NRA, should be run out of Dodge.

They already tried that in other countries, such as - Australia, and crime only rose, probably because

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law-abiding citizens will follow the law, and the thugs and sickos will not, so it does no good. Common sense, huh?

Australia is a bad example for either side - Fanatical Hypocrite

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Despite claims by the Australian government that it lowered gun violence and claims by our own PR department of the NRA that it increased gun violence, the new Australian laws have had almost no statistical effect on the violence. So using that as an example for either side's case isn't that great.

For instance, some studies showed that there was a sharp decline in suicides by shooting. They usually failed to note a sharp increase in suicides by hanging.

However, for the millionth time, this isn't about guns. This is about specific types of guns that aren't needed for self-defense.

Now will new gun laws fix everything? Will the govenrment effectively police and control semiautomatics even if a law is passed? Will criminals take over our major cities and force Batman to come out of retirement? I don't know. But we've tried doing nothing and it just isn't getting better.

Right now there are tons of places where you can carry a concealed weapon anywhere you want. Why are we still having shootings then? If we've got cities full of American cowboys with their pistols ready for the quick draw, then why hasn't crime dropped significantly? Let's face it, random vigilante idiots with no training who are probably compensating for things make terrible police.

What if the principal of that school had a gun? - Possibly would have SAVED lives.

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There are also plenty of examples of 911 calls where people saved their own lives and those of their family by having a gun as some thug was trying to break into their home. So, you don't know! I do not agree personally with taking guns from law-abiding citizens and then only the criminals will carry them (and they WILL find a way !)

So, that's why you need an AK-47? - Fanatical Hypocrite

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Because that's what I'm talking about. How many enemies do you have? I'm talking about semiautomatics. I personally want to get a handgun one day. I just don't plan on having to defend myself from attacking hordes of criminals. Hopefully, I'll never have to shoot anyone. If America gets to the point where I'm regularly attacked by mercenary companies going to the store and need to pack that much firepower, I'll probably just move.

As for if the principal had a gun, you make a valid point. Maybe it could have all been prevented. Or maybe more people would have gotten shot because it would have been a crossfire in a school between two untrained and potentially unskilled shooters. However, judging that gun owners are 4.5 times more likely to die by gunshot than the unarmed, and most of the time they are shot by themselves or family members with their own gun than by an assailant, robber or gunman, it would seem to only make it more likely you'll die tragically.

So, buy a handgun. Get a hunting rifle. Spend your days eating burglar meat (though statistically you'll never get enough to live on because burglaries in occupied homes are rare.) That's your right and will remain so for your whole life. But I don't trust you or me or anyone without proper training, accountability and regular psych evaluations with military grade or mock military grade weapons.

Now, you want to talk about getting the schools well-trained security personnel to handle these crises and I'm all for it. But random armed strangers hanging around our kids with 60 bullet clip semiautomatics to protect them from other people with 60 bullet clip semiautomatics? No thanks.

Or maybe, if they are not outlawed, the clips can be taxed $25-$50 a pop. - Will they waste that much $$. NM

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s

Does not matter! Laws wont matter! More than 400 - kids in Chicago shot so far this year!!!

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They have the strongest gun laws in the country, and they have some of the worst statistics! Don't you get it? Forget the laws. ... useless. Bad guys will get these guns, assault rifles, whatever they want for the right price. Laws mean NOTHING to them !

So should we forget all laws (NM) - that don't work 100%?

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.

You raise an interesting point - Fanatical Hypocrite

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Let's just legalize murder then. Problem solved. In fact, legalize everything. Now there's no more crime. Wow, the solution was so simple.

Alternative solutions to stricter gun laws raised so far:
1. Nothing.
2. Hordes of gun toating vigilantes.
3. Theocracy.

A very productive week.

In CA, a school has armed security guards - backwards typist

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As seen on Inside Edition last night:

A school district in Santa Anna, California, has its own police force to protect 57,000 students and 5,000 staff. It is the only school district in Orange County with its own police force.

INSIDE EDITION’s Jim Moret asked the Police Chief of the school district, David Valentine, “I notice you're armed.”

Valentine said, "Yes, Santa Anna unified school district is the only school district in Orange County to have its own police force."

My school had police - RC

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I thought it was common, since we weren't exactly a violent school. But then, maybe that's why there wasn't violence.

I was shocked that a school could be that large. - backwards typist

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I've never heard of a school with 57,000 students. That's a medium size city in itself! But then, I don't live in a city, either. ;-)

We only had about 1,000 - RC

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I can't image a school that large. It sounds intimidating.

It's 57,000 in the entire district, with 35 elementary, 9 middle - and 9 high school for only

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a 24-square-mile area. Santa Ana is a town, not a city, of about 325,000 with a very dense population. For perspective, in my metro area of about 6 million, we have 24 separate school districts.

it's the entire district - not one school - nm

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My son had an interesting idea... - ZvilleMT

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We have all of these veterans returning home and no jobs - why doesn't each school hire one (two for bigger schools) as security.

No money for it - LeonaG

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Most school districts are really hurting these days. They can't add more personnel.

the NRA has a boatload of money - and it's their big idea

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As of today, this is precisely what the NRA has recommended. So let them pay for it. Alcohol and tobacco are taxed to compensate for their inherent dangers and concomitant costs to public health. I say the NRA should put up or shut up.

I like the police idea, too. - RC (nm)

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