A community of 30,000 US Transcriptionist serving Medical Transcription Industry

JUST FOR THE RECORD

Posted: Jul 23, 2015

;

Confederate Veterans - Yes-- - U.S. Veterans - NO

[ In Reply To ..]

If you’re referring to the 1958 legislation, all it made Confederate veterans eligible for the same VA benefits as Union soldiers were. It did not make them U.S. veterans, make any other official change in their status, or extend any particular protections to graves or monuments.

Read the law. It in no way calls confederate veterans American veterans. You’re talking about Walter Williams. He didn’t receive a US military pension, and he wasn’t a confederate veteran either. He was a phony and a liar. Quit making things up. The gravestones are confederate gravestones, not American military gravestones

My position on this even surprises me. - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
As a conservative, I'm tired of the whole PC phenomenon that's amounted, in my opinion, to a baldfaced liberal attack on the 1st Amendment - always directed against, not speech, but speech that liberals don't like.

My initial reaction to the Confederate flag debate was "Here they go again", and my thinking was that this flag hasn't represented support for slavery for a very long time, and for a lot of southern families, it now represents nothing more or less than the valor and sacrifice of their ancestors on the battlefield. As such, it's a source of family or generational pride more than anything else.

But simple decency, if not ordinary common sense, forces us to acknowledge that for many of our fellow Americans the Confederate flag is something very different - not a source of pride, but of pain. It serves as a vivid reminder of the bondage in which these Americans' ancestors lived, often under harsh and cruel conditions, and a symbol of what was surely the most shameful period in the history of this nation.

It really becomes, then, not a question of constitutionality or "rights", but a demand that is made upon our conscience. Not "what kind of people were we?", but "what kind of people ARE we?"

Individuals and families for whom the Confederate flag represents the sacred blood of their forebears should certainly be allowed to own and reverence the flag privately, by all means. But when it comes to displaying the flag in public view, even if on private property, it seems to me that we are called on to follow a higher path than merely asserting our rights. Perhaps we should view this as a gift from God, namely the opportunity to salvage just a bit of nobility and dignity from the dungheap of slave history.

What is the kind, the generous, the noble thing to do? The Constitution, or the assertion of "our rights", ought not to be the ultimate standard by which we guide our behavior.

Time to get over the Civil War - it was a - l-o-n-g time ago. Their flag - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
only represents one thing nowadays - HATRED.

You don't speak for everybody. Some find the Cuban flag - offensive, those who fled from communists

[ In Reply To ..]
and some people find Che Guevara (the communist) T-shirts offensive.

Then you must understand why most of the - US finds the Confederate flag offensive.

[ In Reply To ..]
Fortunately for the country, haters are still a minority.

The flag issue was started in response to Charleston. It's - too bad the media wanted to

[ In Reply To ..]
spread hate by pushing the Confederate flag issue, rather than the response of forgiveness. That church was targeted because of the good relationship between the races. That's how things are done. It was a great message lost to the media.

It makes some people feel morally superior to focus on the flag removal, rather than the true problem.

Racism and bigotry come in all colors.

It's pretty hard to forgive a flat that represents - those who shoot churchgoers.

[ In Reply To ..]
Or those who enslaved Africans and brought them to America against their will. Or who haven't run the Ku Klux Klan out of their states on a rail. Nope, if they want forgiveness, they're gonna have to try a little harder than that.

*( "Flag", not "flat") - Time for bed...

[ In Reply To ..]

Wow, I'm surprised the Hitler card wasn't played - in there somewhere, too.

[ In Reply To ..]
Not to worry though, as soon as Iran gets nukes none of this will matter.

Wrong flag. - .

[ In Reply To ..]

FYI, the Civil War and World War II are two - entirely different wars.

[ In Reply To ..]
(and flags). History books. They're a GOOD thing.

I think the point was missed. - NM

[ In Reply To ..]
NM

Not an uncommon occurrence on the Pub side. - LOL

[ In Reply To ..]
0

I think the racist inference was lost on our liberal friend (s). - Shazaam!

[ In Reply To ..]
WWII makes me think of John Kerry and Neville Chamberlain.

WWII makes me think of a bunch of propagandized, - lock-stepping conservative sheep.

[ In Reply To ..]
8)

Then you better not forgive the American Flag because - Truthhurts

[ In Reply To ..]
Roof also had pictures taken with the American Flag in one hand and the Confederate Flag in the other.

Are you willing to to that?

I don't recall saying I forgive what the US flag - stands for, either. Its not all good.

[ In Reply To ..]
In fact, we've done a lot of pretty heinous things to people not only in other countries, but here on US soil as well, in the name of a piece of striped cloth with some stars on it.

People need to get over their obsession with flags, which are not holy by any stretch of the word, and focus more on other human beings. It's our only chance at survival of the species.

The problem with this thinking is now that the flag is removed - Truthhurts

[ In Reply To ..]
from the public places, they also want to remove graves and monuments to those who served in the Confederacy. In fact, there is a lot of hoopla in TN right now because people want to remove the grave of a soldier and his wife who have been dead since the late 1800s and rebury them in the nondescript place.

Where will it end?

Hopefully it'll end with wiping out the - confederate mentality.

[ In Reply To ..]
js

Impatient protesters wanted Nathan B. Forest's grave removed, - begin digging up dirt near his

[ In Reply To ..]
grave.

Consequences of a brainwashed narrative?

The only believe who remove the remains of nonbelievers has - been in Islam. Now we have

[ In Reply To ..]
a similar ideology, removing things they don't agree with. Right or wrong, this is desecration.

Thank you - beautifully stated. - Truth

[ In Reply To ..]
I am also a conservative and feel that the human thing to do was to remove the flag from the state capital. You are correct, the flag is both a representation of lives given and lives taken. It is for individuals to decide whether or not to fly the flag on their private property. However, it should not appear on government property as a simple means of respect to all citizens.

Just for the record - Fact check

[ In Reply To ..]
I don't think there were marines during the civil war.

Yes, there were Marines during the CW, although - different than what we

[ In Reply To ..]
think of today.

Oh, great, just like Republicans and - Democrats--just not the same now

[ In Reply To ..]
LOL

Did anyone actually read that U.S. Public Law? - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
The gullibility of some people never ceases to amaze me. The law this poster copied and that the cute little graphic is talking about is referring merely to pensions for widows. It is NOT a declaration that Confederate veterans are "equal to U.S. veterans." Read it. (see link)

"Public Law 85-425, May 23, 1958 | [H. R. 358] 72 Stat. 133

AN ACT To increase the monthly rates of pension payable to widows and former widows of deceased veterans of the Spanish-American War, Civil War, Indian War, and Mexican War, and provide pensions to widows of veterans who served in the military or naval forces of the Confederate States of America during the Civil War."

Lists amendments to amounts.

"(e) For the purpose of this section, and section 433, the term 'veteran' includes a person who served in the military or naval forces of the Confederate States of America during the Civil War, and the term 'active, military or naval service' includes active service in such forces."

I wonder what part of "for the purpose of this section" is confusing people? It's a section that defines who is eligible for a military pension and how much that pension will be and nothing more. All that law did was make the widows of Confederate veterans eligible for the same benefits as the benefits of veterans of the United States/Union. It did not in any way make any dead soldiers "U.S. veterans" or make any other official change in anyone's status.

It wasn't until the 1930s that soldiers of the Confederacy began receiving pensions from the federal government. They weren't proclaimed "United States veterans" then either. Prior to that, confederate soldiers could apply for benefits through the state they resided in. The last verified Civil War veteran receiving a pension was Albert Woolson who died in 1956 at age 109. Believe it or not, the United States government is still paying VA benefits to the daughter of a once Confederate solider who defected to the Union in order to receive pension benefits for his family. She is the last child of any Civil War veteran still on the VA benefits rolls. (see link directly below)

http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303603904579493830954152394

How amusing that the same "patriot" and "heritage" types who generally have nothing but disdain and mockery for the federal government and whine incessantly about moochers are clinging so desperately and incorrectly to this particular legislation as proof of their ancestors' "United States veterans" status when one needs only to read the law they cite to discover that the only status it confers on them is that of "moochers" in that it allowed the surviving traitors and their widows the ability to suck off the teat of the United States government they fought against.

Truth.

The words "deceased VETERANS" is in the bill - Truthhurts

[ In Reply To ..]
which means that Confederate soldiers were recognized.

Spin all you want but to those who believe in the written word, "DECEASED VETERANS WHO SERVED IN THE MILITARY OR NAVAL FORCES OF THE CONFEDERATE STATES OF AMERICA DURING THE CIVIL WAR" means Confederate soldiers were recognized as equal to the Union soldiers by that year or did you want to overlook that phrase and hope others did,too?

No, it made the deceased veterans' widows - eligible for pension-NOT equality

[ In Reply To ..]
;

What is the meaning of the word RECOGNIZE? - Truthhurts

[ In Reply To ..]

You just won't admit that this bill does recognize the Confederate veterans, will you? Here it is again (copied and pasted from the post spouting the law itself:

"....provide pensions to widows of veterans who served in the military or naval forces of the Confederate States of America during the Civil War."

The law RECOGNIZES the widows "OF VETERANS WHO SERVED IN.......CONFEDERATE STATES OF AMERICA....."

Does the definition of RECOGNIZE help?

to know and remember (someone or something) because of previous knowledge or experience

: to accept or be aware that (something) is true or exists

: to accept and approve of (something) as having legal or official authority

and the FULL definition is:

to acknowledge formally: as:

a to admit as being lord or sovereign

b : to admit as being of a particular status

c: to admit as being one entitled to be heard

d: give the floor to

e: to acknowledge the de facto existence or the independence of

Talk about "spin," you have omitted words and created your own quote NOT in the bill. - State the obvious

[ In Reply To ..]
You said: "The words 'deceased VETERANS' is in the bill which means that Confederate soldiers were recognized. Spin all you want but to those who believe in the written word, "DECEASED VETERANS WHO SERVED IN THE MILITARY OR NAVAL FORCES OF THE CONFEDERATE STATES OF AMERICA DURING THE CIVIL WAR" means Confederate soldiers were recognized as equal to the Union soldiers by that year or did you want to overlook that phrase and hope others did,too?"

Well, who is the one spinning here? The words "deceased veterans" are in the bill, but you seem to have deleted words from the bill and thereby changed its meaning and invented a quote not actually in the bill. The part of the bill you have altered by omitting words actually reads:

"An Act to increase the monthly rates of pension payable to widows and former widows of DECEASED veterans of the Spanish-American War, Civil War, Indian War, and Mexican War, and provide pensions to widows of VETERANS WHO SERVED IN THE MILITARY OR NAVAL FORCES OF THE CONFEDERATE STATES OF AMERICA DURING THE CIVIL WAR."

I left the words you quoted in bold, but I added back in the words of the bill that you conveniently omitted so that it would fit your agenda. If the bill is actually read including all the words you omitted, it's meaning is quite clear.

In the words of you: "Did you want to overlook that phrase and hope others did too?"

Also in the words of you: "Spin all you want but to those who believe in the written word," they don't generally leave out a whole bunch of those written words that by their omission changes the meaning of the entire sentence.

As I already stated in my prior post, the bill states:

"(e) For the PURPOSE OF THIS SECTION, AND SECTION 433, the term 'veteran' includes a person who served in the military or naval forces of the Confederate States of America during the Civil War, and the term 'active, military or naval service' includes active service in such forces." (capitalization added)

In other words, the term "veteran" includes Confederate veterans FOR THE PURPOSE OF THIS SECTION, WHICH THE PURPOSE OF THE SECTION IS GRANTING PENSIONS. It DOES NOT universally make either deceased or surviving Confederate veterans the same as U.S. veterans but merely grants them a federal pension around a century after the Civil War.

The bill is clearly worded. In 1958, almost 100 years after the start of the Civil War, the United States government opened up federal pensions to SURVIVING Confederate veterans and their widows even though they or their husbands had fought against the United States government and lived through the Civil War and were alive in 1958. Given that this was almost an entire century after the start of the Civil War, there was a limited number of people by 1958 who were actually qualified to take advantage of the federal pension benefit. Two Confederate veterans and more than one thousand Confederate widows were added to the federal Civil War pension rolls in 1958.

Those are the facts.

Similar Messages:

Aug 13, 2012
Hi I am thinking about becoming a MT but unfortunatly I do have a criminal record. I had gotten into some trouble back in 2008 so now I have a misdemenor assault. It has been hard finding a job, mostly working directly with people but if I do become a MT I would want to work from home to be with my son. Also I was thinking of going though Penn Foster. Will I be able to find a job with the assault? What do you think about Penn Foster?? Thanks! ...

May 02, 2014
over 92 million Americans remain without unemployed. This hope and change thing isn't working out too well. See CBS-DC ...

Feb 17, 2015
Nope, that's racism During his explanation, Alday said he comes "from a town where all the blacks are getting food stamps and what I call 'welfare crazy checks.' They don't work." Alday also told the newspaper about a time he visited an emergency room. “I liked to died. I laid in there for hours because they (black people) were in there being treated for gunshots," Alday was quoted as saying. "I am definitely not a racist, at all," Alday told Mississippi New ...

Sep 23, 2010
Okay, here is my problem. I have been trying to find a copy of a death record/death certificate/obituary online. We have a friend that we have known for over 20 years who we lost contact with about 8 years ago or so. He actually lived with us for over 6 months at one point. He eventually moved back to the area where his family is from and we lost touch. He was one of those friends that you can not see for a long time and then when you do see them again, you pick up ...

Oct 11, 2012
On CNN: A visibly annoyed Stephanie Cutter took issue when a CNN anchor described her job as "spin". Cutter responded, "My job may be to 'spin'... but it's also to put the facts out there." ...

Oct 22, 2012
Published on Oct 20, 2012 by BlackAndRight Despite the fact the Department of Health and Human Services says there are NO Planned Parenthood clinics in the United States licensed to offer mammograms, President Obama and his surrogates continue to claim a defunding of Planned Parenthood will deny women of services they don't offer. ...

Oct 26, 2012
I might be the only one, but this leaves a bad taste in my mouth. The amount of money spent campaigning in this country is ridiculous. And for what? Do those ads even do anything? Do they change peoples' minds? I don't think they do. All they ever seem to me is a childish tit-for-tat that makes us all look stupid. It just feels like both sides are trying to create the ultimate Hollywood film, and whoever's movie is better wins the prize. I'm aw ...

Nov 01, 2012
• 31 straight months of private sector job growth • Largest one-year drop in unemployment rate since February 1995 • Highest private sector employment since 2008 • Best manufacturing job gains since the mid-1990s • Highest manufacturing output in four years • Consumer confidence at highest level in five years • Lowest foreclosure rate in five years • Home prices seeing strongest growth since late 2006 • Household net worth at highest since 2008 ...

Jan 15, 2013
Also, did you guys see the pictures of Beijing? Whether or not you believe global warming is man-made, this cannot go on. "Researchers from Nasa said it was the ninth warmest year while experts from another American agency said it was the tenth. Both teams said that temperatures would have been higher if it hadn't been for the the La Nina weather pattern that brought cooling to some regions. The scientists were equally certain that carbon dioxide was the principal drive ...

Jun 18, 2016
Greta hits it spot on! ...

Nov 30, 2009
MARTINSVILLE, Ohio — With food stamp use at record highs and climbing every month, a program once scorned as a failed welfare scheme now helps feed one in eight Americans and one in four children. It has grown so rapidly in places so diverse that it is becoming nearly as ordinary as the groceries it buys. More than 36 million people use inconspicuous plastic cards for staples like milk, bread and cheese, swiping them at counters in blighted cities and in suburbs pocked with foreclosure si ...

Dec 24, 2009
Of all of the various government healthcare schemes that are or have been in existence, there is only one that has not blown through its estimated costs by at least a factor of 10. The Medicare prescription drug program is the only scheme that has come in at or below estimated costs. It is also the only scheme that is based on private competitive market forces. Capiche? ...

Apr 19, 2011
They pollute the waters and ship the oil to China. What is going on? ...

Sep 07, 2012
http://abcnews.go.com/Business/food-stamps-making-food-companies-fat/story?id=17166643 ...

Mar 05, 2013
Now if only I had some stocks to sell! I guess now is not the time to "stock up," is it?! ...

Jul 02, 2014
My answers were buried so I'll direct you to those posts instead of rewriting everything in them. They would be too long otherwise. One is on the Constitution and one is on Jonathan Turley. http://general.mtstars.com/386135.html http://general.mtstars.com/386115.html ...

Jan 21, 2015
By 2 hundredths of 1 degree centigrade. And NASA scientists are only 38% sure of this. The sky is falling! The sky is falling!! LOL ...

May 30, 2015
i.e. not politicized back-pedaling. In 2003, Sanders was among 32 co-sponsors of the Prison Rape Elimination Act, a measure to “establish a zero-tolerance standard” for sexual violence in prison. (The measure passed unanimously, but enforcement has been weak in the last decade.) In 2011, Sanders co-sponsored a measure to address the rape kit backlog. Here’s how Sen. Dianne Feinstein, another of the bill’s co-sponsors, explained the measure: ”Thousands of rape kits sit untested in ...

Jul 11, 2015
Unknown if his supporters are of the paid variety this time. ...

Jul 11, 2017
There's a lot more to this Record. You'll have to follow the link to see how many confirmed and nonconfirmed nominations for government positions. It might open some eyes. There is plenty more in both bills/laws/resolutions and the nominations/confirmations. I just did a summary to give an idea. See link for full details but it breaks down each arm of the service, too. Resume of Congressional Activity FIRST SESSION OF THE ONE ...

Jan 19, 2010
By John Solomon and Carrie Johnson Special to The Washington Post Tuesday, January 19, 2010 The FBI illegally collected more than 2,000 U.S. telephone call records between 2002 and 2006 by invoking terrorism emergencies that did not exist or simply persuading phone companies to provide records, according to internal bureau memos and interviews. FBI officials issued approvals after the fact to justify their actions. E-mails obtained by The Washington Post detail how counterterrorism of ...

Feb 12, 2010
Profits for five largest health insurers were up 56% in 2009. Let's hear a big round of applause for status quo. Just say no to health care reform and claim a sweeping partisan victory. What I want to know is how the obstructionists and their supporters sleep at night. http://blog.healthcareforamericanow.org/2010/02/11/insurers-enjoy-record-breaking-profits-as-they-cut-27-million-people-from-their-rolls/ ...

Nov 10, 2011
What is wrong with this picture? Class warfare? Just plain old greed. Sotheby's is in a labor dispute with the unionn that represents the art handlers working at the New York City auction house. The contract between the two parties expired on July 1st, 2011, and despite ongoing negotiations, there has been no agreement on a new contract. Local 814's stance is that because of Sotheby's record profits for 2010 (over $680 million), Local 814 should not be giving in to any of S ...

May 14, 2011
Insurance companies and oil companies hoping repub zombie followers dont wise up anytime soon. ...

Sep 10, 2013
sites occasionally when checking out some posts, but marketers think they can make money off my criminal record? Have I managed to "earn" this targeted advertising all by myself or is it a forum/group thing? ...

Dec 16, 2014
And I am one of them. My premium more than doubled and my coverage is not as good. Although I know that some people did need the protection this law apparently afforded them, those of us who did not need the govt's help with this issue should not be penalized for it - especially in this so-called free country. So either repeal it and start over or fix the areas in it that do not work. ...

Mar 17, 2015
BTW, you do realize that our debt has gone OVER the $18 Trillion mark, don't you? It happened on the 15th, but that's another post.WASHINGTON (AP) — Federal agencies set a new record for improper payments last year, shelling out $125 billion in questionable benefits after years of declines. The payments included tax credits for families that didn't qualify, Medicare payments for treatments that might not have been necessary, and unemployment benefits for people who were act ...

Oct 06, 2016
Hundreds and hundreds of them - and 22% of them used guns in their crimes. Commuting sentences isn't something that Presidents have typically done willy-nilly, or in such numbers. Someone last year said "Thank God he only has one more year." I took no comfort in that. I knew that, as bad as the first 7 years of this rogue President's term have been, the last year would be the very worst because there would be literally nothing to stop him from doing whatever he wants to do. ...

Mar 08, 2017
We're on our way to #MAGA! ...

Aug 09, 2017
.S. job openings jumped to a record high in June, outpacing hiring, the latest indication that companies are having trouble finding qualified workers. The Labor Department said on Tuesday that job openings, a measure of labor demand, increased 461,000 to a seasonally adjusted 6.2 million. That was the highest level since the series started in December 2000 and pushed the jobs openings rate up two-tenths of a percentage point to a near one-year high of 4.0 percent. The monthly increase in ...