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Yep - he said death panels

Posted: Feb 8, 2013

Paul Krugman, NYT columnist, Nobel Peace Prize winner, in a speech at the Sixth & I Historic Synagogue in Washington, D.C. in January 2013: â��Weâ��re going to need more revenue, weâ��re going to need, and probably in the end, surely in the end it will require some sort of middle class taxes as wellâ�¦ Weâ��re going to have to make decisions about health care, not pay for health care that has no demonstrated medical benefits. So you know the snarky version I use, which is, I shouldnâ��t even say because it will get me in trouble, is death panels and sales taxes is how we do this.â��;

Yeah, and Sarah Palin - ...

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was crucified in the media for saying the same thing. What gives?

horse of a different color - doe

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Palin was criticized for characterizing elements of healthcare reform as "death panels". These elements include the cessation of death-prolonging interventions of no merit.

When Krugman spoke, he used the term to reference these measures, placing "air quotes" around the term. He even called it the "snarky" version.

There's a big difference between Palin's coining of the term and Krugman's reference to it.

So she was right! - There are death panels.

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She just got crucified for mentioning it without air quotes.

no. cute try. - whooooosh

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Yup, got that one right. Glad someone is - paying attention - nm

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nm

If the vision of 50 million people being murdered while - their loving families do nothing pleases you,

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run with this. What he means by using the term "death panels"--and "the death panel people" (you) before that--is entirely different from what you mean. White and black. Just good sense and unspeakable evil.

Good thing for all of us, because you, and all those supposed Eloi, never did anything to save us from your imagined destruction of America. Just complained "afterward."

BTW, DH and I both have made advance directives, like sensible adults. When it comes to it, we won't need some rep acting in accordance with "death panel" guidelines to sit us down like children and explain what we need to do to take care of ourselves to avoid potential horrible suffering, and yes, leaving the other with a mountain of totally pointless bills, only most of which would be covered by Medicare. We buy supplementary insurance on top of it for DH, and I'm afraid even with that there is a potential for serious debt.

A dem

Wow, ya got some mighty big assumptions there maam - sm

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And you are all over the place, A dem, typical.

1. What vision of 50 million people being murdered? If they are republicans maybe that would please you. But no, not even 1 person being murdered pleases me.

2. Your first paragraph makes no sense. Run with what? Why did you put "you" in parenthesis? Do you think I'm part of the death panel?

3. How do you know what I mean? Your message shows you don't even know what you mean.

4. What's white and black?

5. Good sense and unspeakable evil? Who?

6. What's a good thing for all of us?

7. What is Eloi and why did you include me in it?

8. What imagined destruction of America?

9. Who complained?

10. After what?

11. Who cares if you and your DH have made advanced directives. That is your own personal business. You don't know if I have, which I have, but you didn't know that and it's none of your business. Not everyone wants to do it and that is their right.

Please write a more coherent message next time so we can follow along.

A Proud Republican

Scary! - NM

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.

What political office does Krugman hold? - Fairminded

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and of course I am completely sure this snippet was not taken out of context in any way shape or form...

meh - .

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.

none. he is a columnist. professor, and economist. - doe

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p.s.... - doe

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and you're right. It's out of context, and just another comprehension fail from the right, likely fostered by coverage on the website "Red Alert Politics".

Here is a link to the video of Krugman's actual remarks:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9u2Lf0DdzA

ya it was a sarcastic rhetorical question :) - Fairminded

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meaning he can say whatever he wants - he's not a legislator :) but i know you knew that

To review - "Paul Krugman, NYT columnist, Nobel Peace

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Prize winner"

;)

Yes, Krugman's a mensch and a doer. No Eloi there. - :) nm

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x

Close - BillyJoe

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He actually won a Nobel prize in Economics not Peace.

Incredible what one can get away with - lmn

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if the media is on your side.

We had death panels long before - Fanatical Hypocrite

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Obama. What do you call an insurance company's rejection board? They reject people for pre-existing conditions, being a couple pounds too fat or too skinny, forgetting to dot their i's on some stupid form, errors in the dictation or transcription of a report, a single minor, unrelated misreported date or condition, etc. They came up with any excuse at all to drop people or deny coverage. Is that not a death panel? They did this to children too. Why is it wrong for the government to decide what procedures or medications shouldn't be covered or what people don't need treatment, but it's fine for a corporation to do so? I'm just not getting the difference in the death panels, except that while the corporation has every incentive possible to leave you to die because it makes them billions of dollars, the government will be deciding on cost-benefit analysis as opposed to just cost analysis.

The idea that the government is a malign entity that wishes you nothing but harm, while corporations are your best friend and just want to see you succeed is foolish. The government doesn't care about you, but it's their job to help. On rare occasion, they even do help. Corporations don't care about you and it's their job to bleed you of everything you've got. Health insurance used to be a slaughter house for the poor. I'll take government run health care, likely terrible as it will be, over that any day of the week.

^^^ ladies and gentleman, we have a winner - doe (nm)

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So Palin was maligned for pointing out that - sm

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Obamacare had death panel provisions? But Krugman wasn't?

death panels - (helpful link)

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Krugman is being maligned - Fanatical Hypocrite

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Liberals maligned Palin for it and now conservatives are maligning him. He probably won't receive as much attention because he's an economist and not a massive super celebrity like Palin for which she attracted more positive and negative attention. Also, Krugman is a controversial, yet respectable economist. I don't see eye to eye with him on some issues, but he seems like a smart guy. Hard to tell with an imaginary concept like the economy.

Palin is a failed vice-presidential candidate, failed governor, failed former Alaskan secessionist, failed bridge to nowhere supporter (though she did later succeed retroactively as a bridge to nowhere opponent), failed agent of Fox News, failed big oil puppet, etc. Palin takes more heat in the news because she's a show boat that has nothing to show for it. I mean Obama never shuts up about bin Laden, but at least he did kill bin Laden. Palin never shuts up about stuff that happened only in her own mind. She should jump on the Beck bandwagon and build her own city. A monument to all she almost did. She can have a library with all her favorite books. Which books? All of 'em...

Also, strictly speaking, death panels are a ridiculous name for a necessary part of any society. It's basically a form of slow, national triage. Would you call an organ transplant committee a death panel? Every day they pick winners and losers. The winners go home to their families, the losers die slowly and terribly. Yet there aren't enough organs to go around.

The difference between a transplant committee and an Obama death panel is 99 out of a 100 people made to wait for their procedure or denied their request aren't getting an automatic death sentence. When there's been a big accident and a lot of people end up in the ER, who should get treated first? The person in the nicest suit or the person in the worst condition with the best chance to live? I'm willing to let other people go first if they have the most desperate need. And if it comes down to it, if I have the lowest chance of survival, I'd rather they spend the time and resources trying to save someone whose still got a chance. I'll still complain about it of course and write a really terrible review of the hospital in my own blood before I go, but that's the trade off for living in a society.

Just like conservatives think Obama can do nothing right - -

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libs thinks Palin can't either. Knee jerk. One of us is right.

government vs. private coporations - MTtoMA

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The biggest difference between insurance run by corporations and insurance run by the government will be the chance to appeal a decision/denial of care. There are no appeals with the government. Once they decide that you or your loved one's care is no longer worthy that will be it.

Appeals process - Fanatical Hypocrite

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There is an appeals process for coverage decisions under the Affordable Care Act. Like every single level of the government, there is an appeals process. Also, the appeals process for private insurance is lengthy and near impossible to win because the corporation is actively fighting you. The only way to win your appeals process with private insurance is to lawyer up and if you can afford a good lawyer they wouldn't have denied you coverage in the first place. I actually can't think of any government agency that doesn't have an appeals process. Whether it will work remains to be seen, but it's there and if it's broken we can work on fixing it. Like everything else.

http://www.healthcare.gov/law/features/rights/appealing-decisions/index.html

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