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Pope wants Church to get its mojo back, change focus from divisive
Posted: Sep 19, 2013
targeting gays, contraception and abortion, be more supportive of women, and create a more "inclusive" atmosphere. I wonder how the cons and TPs are going to handle this news. Can't wait for Rush and Flox to issue their TPM on this subject.
http://world.time.com/2013/09/19/pope-francis-expresses-tolerance-of-gays-support-for-women/
;
He's well known as a conservative too. The sensible, - decent, honorable type. In the
[ In Reply To ..]beginning he said he felt homosexuality should be left for God to judge -- notably a choice and belief that have ALWAYS been available through the Bible for all Christians who weren't comfortable with hurting those around them.
Two generations of Catholics are applauding, but.... - sm
[ In Reply To ..]very few were right wingers to begin with, mostly Kennedy democrats and their educated. offspring. The Christian fundamentalist TP members are not likely to care a hoot what the pope says. I am an atheist and am really impressed by the new pope. It seems to me that he "walks the walk".
I agree with your assessment of the Pope. However, the Catholic Church is - financially driven
[ In Reply To ..]and I can't help but think choosing a Pope that might provide a welcome atmosphere to more wallets by broadening tolerance for previously stigmatized groups was a calculated decision.
The Catholic Church as a religion to me is an enigma anyhow. The Bible's basic teachings are pretty uncomplicated, a set of values inherently accepted by the human race (whether or not one believes in a spiritual entity as their creator). But the Catholic Church historically has developed its own set of rules to suit its agenda, the dogma of which has no true literal biblical foundation.
I know this isn't the religion board, but in order to lay a foundation for my opinion, I felt I needed to say that.
I think the Catholic Church had no choice but to choose a Pope that would improve their image and keep them alive financially. This was a calculated move, a decision probably made even before the previous Pope stepped down, IMO of course.
The TP might do well to follow the Catholic Church to enhance popularity, but their basic principles thus far have proved to offer no leeway for tolerance or acceptance. Too bad for the Republicans.
24% of Americans are Catholic. A tilt there will - affect the national dialogue, and NOT
[ In Reply To ..]in a way that will benefit the TPers, since, of course, most are fundamentalist Christians and/or hard right social conservatives (a LOT of overlap).
This isn't the religion board, but don't forget that a strong wing in the Catholic Church wanted to stop pandering to "market" needs and return to basic core beliefs. The Cardinals did have that choice and went the other way. Maybe it wasn't as much in doubt as the media suggested, though? :)
According to Pew there are more Catholic cons than - you might think
[ In Reply To ..]Portrait of Catholic views on social and political issues
http://religions.pewforum.org/portraits
Portraits
Portrait of:
Catholics
9%
33%
15%
10%
10%
23%
Party Affiliation Among Catholics
Question wording: In politics TODAY, do you consider yourself a Republican, Democrat, or Independent? [IF INDEPENDENT, NO PREFERENCE, OTHER PARTY, DK/REF ASK:] As of today, do you lean more to the Republican Party or more to the Democratic Party?
Compare traditions
8%
18%
38%
36%
Political Ideology Among Catholics
Question wording: In general, would you describe your political views as very conservative, conservative, moderate, liberal, or very liberal?
Compare traditions
6%
4%
51%
39%
Views About Size of Government Among Catholics
Question wording: If you had to choose, would you rather have a smaller government providing fewer services, or a bigger government providing more services?
Compare traditions
7%
18%
27%
32%
16%
Views About Abortion Among Catholics
Question wording: On another subject, do you think abortion should be (READ CATEGORIES IN ORDER TO HALF SAMPLE, IN REVERSE ORDER TO OTHER HALF OF SAMPLE) legal in all cases, legal in most cases, illegal in most cases, or illegal in all cases?
Compare traditions
7%
5%
30%
58%
Views About Homosexuality Among Catholics
Question wording: Now I'm going to read you a few pairs of statements. For each pair, tell me whether the FIRST statement or the SECOND statement comes closer to your own views -- even if neither is exactly right. 1 - Homosexuality is a way of life that should be accepted by society, OR 2 - Homosexuality is a way of life that should be discouraged by society.
Compare traditions
5%
3%
49%
43%
Views About Government's Role in Protecting Morality Among Catholics
Question wording: Now I'm going to read you a few pairs of statements. For each pair, tell me whether the FIRST statement or the SECOND statement comes closer to your own views --even if neither is exactly right. 1 - The government should do more to protect morality in society, OR 2 - I worry the government is getting too involved in the issue of morality.
Compare traditions
6%
3%
60%
32%
Views About Environmental Protection Among Catholics
Question wording: Now I'm going to read you a few pairs of statements. For each pair, tell me whether the FIRST statement or the SECOND statement comes closer to your own views -- even if neither is exactly right. 1 - Stricter environmental laws and regulations cost too many jobs and hurt the economy, OR 2 - Stricter environmental laws and regulations are worth the cost.
Compare traditions
2%
6%
55%
36%
Views About Country's Role in World Affairs Among Catholics
Question wording: Now I'm going to read you a few pairs of statements. For each pair, tell me whether the FIRST statement or the SECOND statement comes closer to your own views -- even if neither is exactly right. 1 - It's best for the future of our country to be active in world affairs, OR 2 - We should pay less attention to problems overseas and concentrate on problems here at home.
conservative is NOT synonymous with Tea Party - and...
[ In Reply To ..]Catholic is not synonymous with Christian Fundamentalism.
NO ONE said they were. To the contrary. If YOU - don't want to be taken for a TPer,
[ In Reply To ..]may I suggest you stand up and speak up for your views.
It's not unreasonable to judge people by the company they keep. Extremists have been mingling with mainstream people for a long time, claiming to be one and to speak for all--and taking their power. And from those whose wishes are being subverted? Mostly silence.
"The world is a dangerous place to live; not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it."
Albert Einstein
I'm not tea party OR conservative - (what are you talking about?)
[ In Reply To ..]
Oh, sorry. Then what were you talking about? I just thought - you were being defensive. :) It's
[ In Reply To ..]still the case that no one says conservatism is synonymous with TP. It's not. Mercifully! I've frequently gone out of the way to point that out. TPers seem to run between about 8 and 15% of the electorate depending on how the poller defines them or asks the question.
Also, of course Catholic is not synonymous with fundamentalism. These days most American and European Catholics, very much to the contrary, have moved well away from church orthodoxy--a major problem for the church and a major reason why it's chosen to ramp up its focus on Africa and South America.
Whatever. Sounds like we probably agree with each other at least somewhat somewhere somehow.
I think we do agree - sm
[ In Reply To ..]sorry if my post was confusing. The poster I responded to pointed out that there are many conservative Catholics - which I well understand.
The idea I was trying to get at, however, was that the Catholic church has nothing to do with the Tea Party or the fundamentalist religious right. I don't think TP'ers OR the religious right have any interest in what the pope says. He is the leader of the catholic church, not the leader of a quasi-religious political movement.
Yes, we do. Actually, here in Georgia some evangelicals - still think, and others suspect, the
[ In Reply To ..]Catholic church is in league with Satan, or the Pope's Satan, or some such thing. They're distracted these days by Democrats (and all that means to them) and Muslims, or they'd have a lot more to say on the subject. :)
Let's not forget, though, that the Pope leads the planet's largest church--well over a billion members, and the by far, far, far wealthiest. That man couldn't eat pancakes and sausage in public without it influencing politics around the globe in various ways.
most cons and TP members are not Catholic - ann other
[ In Reply To ..]The right wing Christian movement has little to do with Catholics.
Yes, but see above. 24% is a lot of Americans, - even if only a fraction vote. nm
[ In Reply To ..]x
Really? Then why did Rush try to claim he's - a "conservative"
[ In Reply To ..]and rant on and on about how liberals worldwide are the Pope's enemy?
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2013/03/14/drive_bys_shocked_to_learn_pope_francis_is_catholic
What is because Rush is a windbag who makes a fortune demonizing liberals - Alex?
[ In Reply To ..]?
I don't follow what you're saying - (?)
[ In Reply To ..]The fact that Rush declares liberals to be the enemies of the pope concerns me not. Nor do I care that Rush assigns political ideology to the leader of the Catholic church as he (Rush) speaks out of both sides of his mouth. To quote Rush on the pope: "He's a Catholic! It's no more complicated than that."
Oh, we're quoting Rush? LOL. - ""There's a pathology here, folks.&
[ In Reply To ..]x
the post to which I responded raised the issue of Rush - sm
[ In Reply To ..]...and from the link posted, I see that Rush had a great many, typically paranoid things to say about politics and the pope. I posted Rush's own quote in order to disarm his low-info fable. The pope is catholic. It's as simple as that.
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