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My jaw dropped when I read this
Posted: Aug 13, 2012
From Joe Biden's speech today in NC: "My dad used to have another saying, for real," Biden said. "And, by the way, I've been saying this for 30 years. And I'm glad to see that Congressman Ryan likes his dad, too, and quotes his dad. I mean that sincerely. But my dad [had] a lot of wisdom. Every time someone tell you, say, 'Look, let me tell you what's important to me, what I value.' My dad would go, 'No, no. Don't tell me what you value. Show me your budget, and I will tell you what you value.'" Ryan's father died when the congressman was 15 years old. source: weeklystandard.com ;
Ryan - back to the Bush - Kick the sick and elderly to curb
[ In Reply To ..]Privatizing social security--just like the free fall of the investment market under Bush and the wild free for all the big firms like Bain Capital took advantage of. We don't have too look to far to see what is important to Ryan.
Kick the sick and elderly to curb - Sums up Obamacare
[ In Reply To ..]We don't have to look far to see what is important to Obama.
30 MILLION MORE PEOPLE WITH HEALTH INSURANCE - I heart Obamacare!
[ In Reply To ..]Good for MTs and good for the uninsured people at risk for disease and financial disaster.
And the Kool-AId drinking continues - ...
[ In Reply To ..].
I don't heart obamacare - and want to buy my own insurance...
[ In Reply To ..]...not allowed under obamacare. I'll be penalized a tax!
Me too - Obamacare all about control - Nothing to do with healthcare
[ In Reply To ..]Not to mention the mass exodus of doctors leaving, the docs refusing to accept Medicaid. Yup, nice to have that card in your wallet, but doesn't do much good if no docs available.
Best part of all, those that were singing the praises on here about the refund checks they got from their insurance, have to pay taxes on that refund depending on how their premiums were handled. Wonder if they will be as happy when they get the 1099 for those refuned checks. Yea....real good deal.
yes, it's all about control. Period. The Libs fail to realize (sm) - Aunt Sue
[ In Reply To ..]that Obamacare has already shredded Medicare and the old folks. He has cut it drastically. Many doctors won't even take it now. Plus they don't even know what Paul Ryan's bill is about, yet they tear it up, because Obama told them to. Very easily led. I do believe liberalism is a mental disorder - it must be.
People in my state are penalized... - s/m
[ In Reply To ..]...if they drive a car without carrying car insurance. It's been that way for all the 36 years I've lived here and probably way before that. And this is a solid red, extremely conservative state. No one wants to be burdened with the medical bills of someone who is idiotic enough to drive without insurance coverage.
I don't want to pick up the medical bills numbering in the tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars for someone who wants to exercise their right to be an ignoramus.
Romney liked health care for everyone in his state when he was governor. I don't see how something like this should make a difference depending on which side of a state line you live on. I want healthcare coverage for all; and believe it or not, I have a right to my beliefs and opinions, too!
Same tired old bogus argument - Under OBAMACARE YOU
[ In Reply To ..]Paying for everbody...read the law. You are FORCED TO BUY A PRODUCT BECAUSE YOU BREATHE.
You don't want to drive a car and pay the insurance...take a bus, taxi, walk, ride a bike, car pool. You have options.
Under Obamacare all your options were taken away regarding healthcare.
Under Obamacare, you are paying for illegals, you are paying for addicts that refuse to work and only want to get high, you are paying for EVERYBODY.
Economics 101 would be immensely helpful; followed socialism 101.
Some
Don't you mean Romneycare? - Just sayin' nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Nope - I said what I meant OBAMACARE - Maybe YOU were referring to OBAMACARE
[ In Reply To ..]Usual arrogant Lib response to tell a poster they could not possibly know what they wanted to post...as if the Libs had all the answers. Yeah right!
FYI: Obamacare=Romneycare, exactly the same. nm - VTMT
[ In Reply To ..].
FYI - no it's not - you "need" to do some research
[ In Reply To ..]and get back to us ...K
My research... - see message
[ In Reply To ..]Romneycare and Obamacare Differ Only in Inconsequential Ways
Romney is struggling to distance himself from the health-care law he passed while governor of Massachusetts, and no wonder—the state and federal plans are virtually identical.
No other issue--not his wealth, his 15 percent tax rate, or “corporations are people, my friends”--has given Mitt Romney as much trouble as the health care law he passed while governor of Massachusetts. Each of Romney’s opponents has taken a shot at the law Tim Pawlenty dubbed Obamneycare, pointing out again and again that it was the inspiration for President Obama’s reform so loathed by the Republican base. At a town hall rally in Ohio Monday, a Romney supporter pleaded for the candidate to give her something to say to critics. "I understand that Romneycare was good for Massachusetts at the state level, whereas Obamacare is federally mandated," she said. But "I don't know what the fundamental differences between the two [are] and I really would like your assistance with being able to tell others."
Mitt Romney signed the Massachusetts health care reform bill on April 12, 2006 in Boston. (David L. Ryan, The Boston Globe / Getty Images)
The problem for Romney is that there are no fundamental differences between the two laws. Both programs create exchanges where private insurers compete. Both require individuals to purchase insurance. And both subsidize those who can’t afford it. It’s a relatively new way of extending coverage. Massachusetts was the first place it was adopted, and the Affordable Care Act was the second. The two laws are, in the words of Jonathan Gruber, who helped design both the Romney and Obama plans, “the same fucking bill.”
To find any differences between the two, you must look to the margins.
The Individual Mandate
This is the part of the Affordable Care Act that really enrages Republicans, whose challenge to it is awaiting judgment by the Supreme Court. It’s an essential part of both plans. The only difference between Romney’s mandate and Obama’s is that Romney’s plan levies a harsher penalty on people who don’t buy insurance: $1,200 versus Obama’s $695.
It’s not something Romney can easily distance himself from. Last week Buzzfeed uncovered a 2009 op-ed by Romney in which he urges Obama to follow Massachusett’s lead and adopt the mandate. “Using tax penalties, as we did, or tax credits, as others have proposed, encourages ‘free riders’ to take responsibility for themselves rather than pass their medical costs on to others,” he wrote.
Subsidies
Both plans subsidize people who can’t afford to buy insurance on an exchange. The only difference is that Massachusetts gives more money to fewer people (anyone earning up to 300 percent of the poverty level), while Obama’s plan gives less money to more people (anyone earning up to 400 percent of the poverty level).
Employer Mandate
Again, both plans require employers to provide insurance, and again the differences are marginal. In Massachusetts companies with 11 or more employees must provide insurance or pay a $295 penalty per employee. Under the Affordable Care Act, companies with 50 or more employees must offer insurance or pay a $2,000 penalty per employee. Romney’s plan affects smaller businesses; Obama’s levies harsher penalties.
The two laws are, in the words of Jonathan Gruber, who helped design both the Romney and Obama plans, ‘the same f------ bill.’
Young Adults
Both plans let children stay on their parents’ plan until they’re 26 years old. The only difference is that in Massachusetts children can stay on their parents’ plan for two years after they’re no longer claimed as a dependent or until they turn 26, whichever comes sooner.
Limits to Benefits
The Affordable Care Act forbids insurers from placing limits on the benefits someone can receive over their lifetime or in a given year. Romney's plan doesn’t, but most Massachusetts plans don’t place limits anyway because it could run afoul of the state’s Minimum Creditable Coverage regulations.
Pre-existing Conditions, Rescission
Both plans require insurers to cover pre-existing conditions and prohibit insurers from rescinding coverage retroactively. However, in Massachusetts an insurer can limit coverage of certain pre-existing conditions to six months, whereas there’s no limit under the Affordable Care Act.
Preventative Care
Insurers in Massachusetts are allowed to charge co-pays for preventative care, whereas preventative care is free under the Affordable Care Act. However, the Massachusetts program requires insurers to cover preventative care without a deductible.
Contraception
The latest aspect of the Affordable Care Act to come under fire is the inclusion of contraception under the forms of “preventative care” insurers must provide for free--including some businesses and colleges with religious affiliations. Romney tried to capitalize on the issue when he told the woman at the Ohio town hall that one key difference between his insurance plan and Obama’s is that his doesn’t require religious institutions to cover practices that are against their belief. That’s true, but tenuously. Romney’s plan doesn’t mention contraception, but only because Massachusetts already had a similar mandate. Under the 2002 law, insurers must cover contraception in the same way they cover other prescription drugs. Unlike Obama’s law, the Massachusetts law didn’t require insurers to provide contraception for free, but it did require them to cover it.
The substance of Romney’s health care reform is so similar to Obama’s that he’s been forced to invoke states rights to defend himself, saying that federal government is wrong to force other states to adopt a Massachusetts-like plan. But as his 2009 op-ed makes clear, his resistance to a federal mandate is fairly recent. And there’s plenty more where that came from. For example, there’s the 2008 ABC News debate, where Charlie Gibson pointed out that Romney “backed away from mandates on a national basis,” and Romney replied, “No, no, I like mandates. The mandates work.”
by Josh Dzieza
This is an - interesting read
[ In Reply To ..]Thank you for posting it.
Actually, you are paying for them now in your ever - increasing premiums NM
[ In Reply To ..]x
"I heart Obamacare -- Right there with you! - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
oh really? - fed up
[ In Reply To ..]let's see - when your sweet caring Obama signed the ACA, my premiums, that were promised NOT to to up, increased $40/month!!! BANG. My mom was told by her doctor that seniors would be pretty much "numbers" and it is true they would have so much govt paperwork to do AND calls to make for permission on tests and procedures that many docs are LEAVING THEIR BELOVED PROFESSION IN DROVES.. and that is the tip of the iceburg. The majority of insured people perfectly satisfied with their healthcare are now screwed for the few that needed it OR sit there on their couch waiting for a handout. Ridiculous.
Do you control C or right click? - Don't hurt your copy finger
[ In Reply To ..]Never know when you might need it to type an original thought. Just my opinion.
For your insulting comments, poster - probably uses the middle finger
[ In Reply To ..]"Just my opinion".
Tsk! Tsk! so vulgar - I can guess your party
[ In Reply To ..]such a way with words.
Communist party - You?
[ In Reply To ..]Thanks Comrade. About time your recognize a real wordsmith.
Did you know Comrade Ryan - voted for
[ In Reply To ..]the $700 billion bank bailout, the biggest Medicare expansion in U.S. history, a massive highway bill that included the Bridge to Nowhere, and other big-ticket priorities when shrub was president? You do now.
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