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Obamacare Architect Gruber Ties Subsidies to State-Based Exchanges
Posted: Jul 25, 2014
I believe this supersedes that noted below, but I will defer to the experts.;
No, sorry, that would not "supersede" that noted below. - sm
[ In Reply To ..]I doubt if the Supreme Court will take Gruber's opinion or interpretation in a video(s) as above their own interpretation of the intent of the ACA. Gruber is NOT a member of Congress nor a Congressional staffer and would NOT be considered a good indicator of Congress’ intent in drafting the ACA. These comments came 2 years after the bill was signed into law and are NOT sworn testimony.
If the SCOTUS considers these words made by Gruber (again, NOT sworn to and in contradiction to his sworn testimony) in order to decide the law's intent, they would have to discount their own findings and their own interpretation of the intent of Congress and the ACA in its totality (which is very clear on the subject)--that are already set forth in their dissent--in favor of these videos and that one badly worded sentence. That shouldn't happen. For the Supreme Court to ignore intent as defined already by them and the totality of the ACA would be astonishing and completely uncharacteristic. Indeed, such a ruling would neuter every law written and call into question any law based on vague language and open to interpretation. But would we put that past this Supreme Court? No.
So although conservatives may win the battle over a definition, they'd gut the ACA over a technicality and most likely lose the war in the long run by denying 10+ million people their subsidies when all they'd have to do is amend the sentence and move on. I believe they could then kiss their chances of winning the White House goodbye. It'll be fun to watch their party divide further over it and watch conservatives try to take both sides of the issue. LOL. Get your popcorn ready.
Yes, "supersede." - Like I said,
[ In Reply To ..]I'll defer to the experts.
Article from NJ in 2012 - Gruber revelations not new
[ In Reply To ..]Looks like this was a fairly well known detail.
Stiill stands that difference is whether the intent of law was for federal exchange participants to receive the same tax credits as state exchange participants or not. Will SCOTUS rule on intent or letter of law?
He supports Obamacare and helped write - it, he's an Obamanite SM
[ In Reply To ..]Why should anybody be surprised that a constitutionally indefensible federal healthcare bill that was irresponsibly not read before it was passed is self-destructing? It’s kind of like finding a Trojan Horse inside a Trojan Horse.
Well, well, well...
Obama advisor Gruber: “you don’t set up an Exchange, that means your citizens don’t get their tax credits
Look at the congression hearings and the so - called speako, the
[ In Reply To ..]actual minutes from congressional hearings deny subsidies to those states that chose not to have exchanges, not only is a part of the law but a main feature.
The Dems spin like Tasmanian devils.
The new IRS form proves Obama lied about - the individual mandate,
[ In Reply To ..]there's a surtax line created just for this. In other words, a subsidy tax. It's a tax and should be represented as such, Which is exactly what the democrats wanted to avoid by just showing it as another deduction like SS on your pay stub.
I know John Roberts ruled it a tax, but Obama said it wasn't. I have no faith in any branch of government anymore.
A new tax form proves Obama lied 4-5 years ago? - Spew alert.
[ In Reply To ..]This sounds similar to the silly Sarah Palin argument. This argument still sounds just as convoluted as the day Sarah made it based on Chief Justice of the Supreme Court John Roberts' decision to uphold Obamacare by calling the mandate a tax and then silly Sarah basically accusing President Obama of retroactively lying by calling it a mandate rather than using the word tax. Now we are to believe a new tax form retroactively proves the same thing? Well okay then, LOL.
Speaking of silly Sarah, today is July 26 and the fifth anniversary since she stopped serving the citizens of the State of Alaska in order to ride the money train, proving once and for all to everyone exactly what her priorities actually are. Cha-ching!
Warning, Tanzmanian devil spin, how do - go from this to Sarah Palin? nm
[ In Reply To ..]x
What part of "this sounds similar to the silly Sarah Palin argument" is confusing? - It does sound similar.
[ In Reply To ..]You are accusing Obama of lying in the past based on something new (a tax form), and you also cite Justice Roberts' as the one who ruled the mandate a tax.
Where's the actual spin?
No spin, facts. The point is, Obama lied by not - calling it a tax when in
[ In Reply To ..]fact it is a tax. More lies, just like the "refugees" invading across the Southern Border which Obama is calling a “shared responsibility”
Stop trying to defend a liar.
The invaders have 4 governments advancing their - interests, US, Mexico,
[ In Reply To ..]El Salvador and Honduras, as well as La Raza, MSM, and numerous other groups.
US citizens have no one protecting their interests from the invasion.
I will defend whom I please. LOL. - nm
[ In Reply To ..]:)
We live in a world full of Winston Smiths - who worked in the Ministry of
[ In Reply To ..]Truth. His job is to rewrite historical documents so they match the constantly changing current party line.
White House has about 9000 staffers doing - this. nm
[ In Reply To ..]x
That's why I don't go to Wikipedia. Congress - has been caught just
[ In Reply To ..]reading something into our out of the official record as they see fit, like speeches the record includes with those made on the floor when they were really handed to the clerk for inclusion in the record. Then they can refer to the official record and edit Wikipedia to match it.
More lies, the feds are supposed to notifiy states - before illegals are sent there,
[ In Reply To ..]well, Indiana just received 200 and the governor said he was never notified.
Sarah WHO? - sm
[ In Reply To ..]The days of this "half-governor" being relevant are far, far gone!
Become an Indian or Amish, they are exempt, - From the IRS web site...
[ In Reply To ..]Exempt groups...
Religious conscience. You are a member of a religious sect that is recognized as conscientiously opposed to accepting any insurance benefits. The Social Security Administration administers the process for recognizing these sects according to the criteria in the law.
2.Health care sharing ministry. You are a member of a health care sharing ministry.
3.Indian tribes. You are (1) a member of a federally recognized Indian tribe or (2) an individual eligible for services through an Indian care provider.
I get it now, the "fines" will fund Obamacare.
#3 exempts E. Warren. - sm
[ In Reply To ..]Ain't she lucky?! LOL
Fauxcahontas .... - NM
[ In Reply To ..]NM
Might as well include the SCOTUS in your "spin" scenario - sm
[ In Reply To ..]since the SCOTUS has already interpreted the intent of the law in the same manner.
I wonder what part of Section 1321 of the ACA is unclear to those 2 judges in the D.C. Circuit Court? ACA Section 1321 sets up federal exchanges and states that when states fail to construct an exchange that the federal government shall "establish and operate such Exchange within the State and the Secretary shall take such actions as are necessary to implement such other requirements."
IMO, the best article regarding the entire case states (see link): "the Halbig case holds that Obamacare's subsidies are illegal in the 36 states where the federal government runs (or partly runs) the exchange. The plaintiffs rely on an unclearly worded sentence in the law to argue that Congress never intended to provide subsidies in federally-run exchanges and so the subsidies that are currently being provided in those 36 states are illegal and need to stop immediately. This is plainly ridiculous. The point of Obamacare is to subsidize insurance for those who can't afford it. The point of the federal exchanges is to make sure the law works even in states that can't or won't set up an exchange.
For Congress to write a law that provides for federal exchanges but doesn't permit money to flow through them would have been like Congress writing a transportation law that builds federal highways but doesn't allow cars, bikes or buses to travel on them."
Medicaid buy-in (single payer) on the one hand - and on the other hand
[ In Reply To ..]$250 deductible major medical with total underwriting based on health status, health habits and age...with rock bottom premiums; cumulative, unlimited Health Savings Accounts, available with matching rising deductibles (for lower premiums); the ability to purchase all health insurance products across state lines and interstate portability; and every other free market concept you can think of.
Let the competition begin.
Insurance Companies are the winners - in opposing Obamacare
[ In Reply To ..]My mother-in-law is a 3 time breast cancer survivor. Her insurance through the ACA is the first insurance she has been able to get in 10 years. Sure, kick her to the curb, because that's what your idea of insurance is going to result in. More of the same cherry picking who they will insure and profits out of this world.
Anyone know anyone who has received a check in the mail from capping insurance profits?
BRAVA! - sm
[ In Reply To ..]It's really sad (if not downright EVIL) that some on this board would prefer to see insurance company profits soar and less Americans able to afford health insurance. They probably want the law to be changed back to ALLOW pre-existing conditions to deny insurance coverage for people.
I'm very happy that millions more Americans are able to afford to pay for their insurance. It's not an "exclusive club" that only the rich can join. It's a human RIGHT!
I'd like it a lot better if a single payer system would be in place!
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