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Buy a $15,000 Policy or Go to Jail


Posted: Nov 9, 2009

PELOSI: Buy a $15,000 Policy or Go to Jail

http://republicans.waysandmeans.hous...umentID=153583

JCT Confirms Failure to Comply with Democrats’ Mandate Can Lead to 5 Years in Jail
Friday, November 06, 2009


Today, Ranking Member of the House Ways and Means Committee Dave Camp (R-MI) released a letter from the non-partisan Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) confirming that the failure to comply with the individual mandate to buy health insurance contained in the Pelosi health care bill (H.R. 3962, as amended) could land people in jail. The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain “acceptable health insurance coverage” and who choose not to pay the bill’s new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income), are subject to numerous civil and criminal penalties, including criminal fines of up to $250,000 and imprisonment of up to five years.

In response to the JCT letter, Camp said: “This is the ultimate example of the Democrats’ command-and-control style of governing – buy what we tell you or go to jail. It is outrageous and it should be stopped immediately.”

Key excerpts from the JCT letter appear below:

“H.R. 3962 provides that an individual (or a husband and wife in the case of a joint return) who does not, at any time during the taxable year, maintain acceptable health insurance coverage for himself or herself and each of his or her qualifying children is subject to an additional tax.” [page 1]

- - - - - - - - - -

“If the government determines that the taxpayer’s unpaid tax liability results from willful behavior, the following penalties could apply…” [page 2]

- - - - - - - - - -


“Criminal penalties

Prosecution is authorized under the Code for a variety of offenses. Depending on the level of the noncompliance, the following penalties could apply to an individual:

• Section 7203 – misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year.

• Section 7201 – felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of up to five years.” [page 3]

When confronted with this same issue during its consideration of a similar individual mandate tax, the Senate Finance Committee worked on a bipartisan basis to include language in its bill that shielded Americans from civil and criminal penalties. The Pelosi bill, however, contains no similar language protecting American citizens from civil and criminal tax penalties that could include a $250,000 fine and five years in jail.

“The Senate Finance Committee had the good sense to eliminate the extreme penalty of incarceration. Speaker Pelosi’s decision to leave in the jail time provision is a threat to every family who cannot afford the $15,000 premium her plan creates. Fortunately, Republicans have an alternative that will lower health insurance costs without raising taxes or cutting Medicare,” said Camp.

According to the Congressional Budget Office the lowest cost family non-group plan under the Speaker’s bill would cost $15,000 in 2016.
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This is not democracy in my opinion - gourdpainter

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I don't see how any AMERICAN can support this bill. I have written to my Democrat Senator letting her know what I think of this bill....not that it will do any good. ALL politicians do what they want regardless of what the people want.

Natural consequences - then?

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If someone is able to afford insurance and doesn't purchase it, and cannot pay up front, what do you think should happen then?

Free health care, I guess - NJ

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If they won't pay, my guess is that they want it free. Dang commie socialists.

NJ

Whether you want to believe it or not - Tired of it all

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It is every American's right to decide whether or not they want to purchase health care insurance. I don't care whether you like it or not. That is the law. You may not think it's unfair, but forcing someone to buy something they don't want is unconstitutional.

What your trying to do is tax everyone in America "more" so healthcare can be provided for those who don't have it for free (and on top of that it still won't cover everyone but you seen fine with that, which I cannot figure that one out). So what's next? An extra tax because people don't want to pay rent, so we'll just give them free housing. Hey how about clothing, free cable to after all it's their right to be able to be informed about the news and stuff.

Oh and what's next? Tax everyone to make sure we use Listerine because it prevents cavities and we will have fewer trips to the dentist. Good for everyone right? Hey why stop there. Tax everyone so they have to take vitamins because vitamins will help you from getting sick. The list can go on and on and on.

"The Constitution created a federal government limited to its enumerated powers. Everything Congress is allowed to do is spelled out in Article I. The 10th Amendment makes it explicit: âThe powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.â

"Nothing in the Constitution authorizes any federal involvement in healthcare â yet Congress may soon require everyone in America to buy insurance."

This is so not good in so many ways. They won't stop with that. Next will be decided when you can and can't drive on the road (carbon emissions), deciding whether you can or cannot own a car (you're within walking distance of stores, and the exercise is good for your health), whether or not you can buy soda, chips, or other snacks. Your obese so you don't need them. Good for your health, good for everyone right? The list goes on and on and on.

I myself have health care. It's a catastrophy plan because I can't afford insurance to go to the doctor for anything, but this covers me if something major happens. It is my right as an American and according to the constitution to decide whether or not I want to spend more money and get a different plan. I personally feel it's foolish not to have insurance in case a catastrophy hits, but that is MY opinion. Nobody should be forcing anyone to buy something they don't want to. And that's the law whether you like it or not.
I don't think that's what the tax is for - the original me
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You said: What your trying to do is tax everyone in America "more" so healthcare can be provided for those who don't have it for free...

I dont think that's what the tax is for - if it sticks in the final bill. I think it's to offset the cost of care for those who refuse to carry a health care plan but WILL eventually need care.

I wouldn't get too worried about the plan yet, the Senate will likely redo the whole thing anyway.
Boy, are you in for a surprise! - Smitty
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My best friend has had "catastrophic" insurance coverage for years. Last year, he was diagnosed with advanced renal cell carcinoma. His insurance company paid for a radical nephrectomy (after he met his deductible and out-of-pocket maximum), but they would not pay for any doctor's office visits or medications. Beginning in January 2009, the insurance company has refused to pay for anything related to his cancer. They will not pay for scans, chemotherapy, medications, doctor's office visits, or anything else unless he has a new "catastrophic" event. I guess if something happens to you, you will be tickled pink that you were not forced to have coverage and just suffer like my friend is suffering now.

Best of luck to you!
My feelings about this - Tired of it all
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I'm not speaking for everyone here...I am speaking for myself.

If I get cancer or some serious illness - that's the way it goes. I will deal with it. I will never ever ever take chemo/radiation in a hundred years. I have no fear of dying or what is in store for me in my next life. And with what I'm seeing going on in this country and how some people think that post blogs like this the sooner I'm gone the better.

I'm sorry your friend is suffering. My mom had lung cancer. She suffered horribly and she had the best insurance. Everything was paid for but she suffered horribly. Nothing like holding your mother in your arms while she's crying and asking to die because she's in horrible pain. Very very heartbreaking. I will never ever go through what she did. Give me the blue pill.

What gets me is you (not you personally but a lot of posters here) seem to think only people that don't have insurance suffer. Not true. There are people all over who have the best insurance money can buy that suffer.

Health care needs to be affordable for all. If I could buy the same policy that people in another state can get for less money, I'd be able to go to the doctor when I need to. That is what we need. We need health care thats affordable for all. We need stricter laws that private insurance companies will not turn away people with illness and we need stricter laws that an insurance company will accept people with pre-existing conditions. Americans do NOT want the Pelosi-crap-care that they are trying to pass, however they won't even join it because its that bad.

Well, then... - Smitty
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When you get sick, don't go to the doctor, don't take medicine or any other treatment, and just die in peace. It is an easy decision to make when you are not staring death right in the face, but you may change your mind when you are. At least your mother had the choice to have diagnostic tests and treatment if she wanted it. The same cannot be said of my friend.

In one breath, you say that you want affordable health care for everyone and that private insurance companies should not be allowed to turn away people with preexisting illnesses. In another breath, you say that you are vehemently against health care reform. You cannot have it both ways!
She didn't say she was against healthcare reform - sm
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just that she's against Pelosi's plan!!!! Why is that so hard to understand? Pelosi's plan is 2,000+ pages of crap that mostly has nothing to do with your healthcare.

There is a better way to do it, that is the point that so many of us are trying to make. If you would seriously do some research on Pelosi, she would scare the mess out of you. All she cares about is power, not you, not your friend or anyone else in this country who is depending on those in Washington to make the decisions that are right for us - not right for them. But that fact is lost on so many people and it is scary!
Thank you - see message - Tired of it all
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I'm glad someone out there is listening to me and not putting words down I didn't say.

It all comes down to choices that we Americans should be making on our own. Following the constitution. Not government telling us what we will and will not do with our money.

I do want reform. I think the GOP has some very good ideas but the democrats in office will not listen to them. They think they have the supreme power.

You are right Pelosi is one scary ____. The more I look at her the more I get nauseous. And then to hear what she has to say. I just read this is morning...

CNSNews.com: âMadam Speaker, where specifically does the Constitution grant Congress the authority to enact an individual health insurance mandate?â

Pelosi: âAre you serious? Are you serious?â

CNSNews.com: âYes, yes I am.â

Pelosi then shook her head before taking a question from another reporter. Her press spokesman, Nadeam Elshami, then told CNSNews.com that asking the speaker of the House where the Constitution authorized Congress to mandated that individual Americans buy health insurance as not a "serious question."

All I have to say is what a freakin C she is.
Good ideas from the GOP? - Smitty
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Please explain exactly what the GOP is proposing for health care reform and why you think it is so much better than the plan that just passed in the House. If you are against the current plan just because you hate Nancy Pelosi, you are very shortsighted.
I am against the plan because it's bad for America - Tired of it all
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Well since you haven't read the GOPs plan I suggest you do some research. Just because you hate anyone that is a republican/conservative/independent is not a reason to not even look at their plan.

I'm not going to do your research for you. You know where you can find it. Plenty of links, but heh, I'm sure you won't even read it.

If you are for the current plan just because you love Pelosi you are very shortsighted.
Apparently, you are unable to answer my question. - Smitty
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You were the one who brought up the GOP plan, and I simply asked you to explain what it is about the GOP plan that you like so much. If you are not able to answer my question, just say so. I am not asking you to do any research for me, I am only asking for your opinion. If you truly have an opinion of your own, it should be an easy question to answer.
I will answer this shortly - I am working right now - Tired of it all
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Give me a break so I can finish my work. I don't spend 24 hours a day lurking in this forum. I come on when I have some breaks in work.

I will answer your question when I get a chance to.
Answer to your question - Tired of it all
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Finally finished work so now I can answer.

This is what I like about the GOP plan:

Instead of govt insurance it reforms the system. It will create high-risk insurance pools, allow people to purchase insurance across state lines (Excellent!!!!!!). It will lower the cost of health care and increase access to good quality health care. It includes people with pre-existing conditions. It will lower costs for small businesses. The rates would drop by anywhere from 5 to 10%.

Individual will have what they call a âone-stop marketplaceâ to choose what plan they want. So I can choose the same plan someone in Kansas or Missouri pays which would cut my premium by about $300. And on top of that it would cover doctors visits and preventive visits.

It would offer coverage to any individual regardless of their health history or age. The GOP is also looking at âThe Patients Choice Act of 2009 which ends tax breaks for employers who provide insurance, and instead gives a $5710 tax cut to families and $2290 to individual to help them pay for insurance coverage.

The GOPâs plan will lower the cost of health care, which means more people will be able to afford it. You wonât be refused health care due to any medical condition and you wonât be dropped from your insurance plan if you have a serious illness.

Lower cost of health care means more people will be able to afford to buy it and people will more likely tend to go to the doctor when they are sick and not wait.

So...if everyone who claims to be so interested in getting more people insured this is the plan to go with.

We do not need to destroy existing health insurance companies, we need to put stricter regulations on them.

Problem with Pelosi-crap-care plan is that it will not insure everyone, and you either join it or you pay anywhere from 25K to 250K and/or go to jail anywhere from 1 to 5 years. Sorry, not such a good plan.

On top of that they will destroy the health care system. They are incompetent with no knowledge of how to run anything. Take a look at Medicare, VA, the indian reservations health care system. Those are all government run programs and they have destroyed them. Not to mention the post office and other non-health related agencies.

With the Pelosi-crap-care, the quality of health care will deteriorate, the older you get the less fortunate you will be, and the quality of your care will deteriorate. Like England and Canada you will have to wait months and months if not years before you can get a test you need, but by then it will be too late and like a lot of people in England you will end up dying of the disease before you even are able to get the tests you need. Granted that some snively slimy politician sitting behind a desk with absolutely no knowledge of medical information will be the one deciding on whether or not he will allow you the tests/medication/treatment your doctor wants you to get.

Cost of GOP plan 61 billion
Cost of Pelosi-crap-care 1.05 trillion.

With the 10 trillion we are already in debt now within this past short year, we cannot afford to do this to our country or our people.
OK your post was full of opinion and not much more - bringing to top - The Original Me
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Posting new topic.
Smitty, have you read the GOP reform? - sm
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It's online.
Health Care Reform GOP Style - Smitty
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Comparing the House Republican and Democratic health-care bills is like comparing a mouse to an elephant. The two measures are different in ambition and therefore in size: The newly released GOP bill is deliberately modest and has an accordingly modest impact.
I never said I was against health care reform. - Tired of it all
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Show me in my post where I said I was against health care reform. I didn't.

I said I want affordable health care for everyone. Just not the Pelosi-crap-care they are trying to shove down our throats. That is not what America wants. We want a better plan. I want affordable health coverage for all. Or if there are those who don't want to pay for health care that's their prerogative and I want them to have that choice. I personally think its foolish not to have something, but I am not pushing my beliefs on someone else. It's everyone's constitutional right to decide what they want to spend their money on. Not mine, not yours and not some millionaire politicians who won't even join the crap-care themselves. What I want is to be able to pay the $180 that someone in Idaho pays and be able to go to the doctor if I need to or want to. Not the $500 plan I have and still have to pay out of pocket for my Pap smears, lab test, mammogram, ultrasound, or any other visit/test I feel I need to or want to go to the doctor for. But if John and Sue or Mary and Jose or anyone else out there is perfectly healthy and they don't want to spend money on health care because they'd rather feed their kids and spend the money on their education then that is their right and they should have that right. It's what the constitution says and I agree with the constitution and what our founding fathers wrote.

Please do not put words in my mouth I did not say (or rather words in this board I did not say).

As for getting "seriously" ill. No I will not get the killer treatment. I will just die in peace when my time comes and God wants me back home. I will not prolong it for another year while suffering in pain and agony for that extra time. That's my choice. Do you even understand the word choice?
Republican reform vs Dem reform - NJ
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I think the issue might be that many of us do not consider the Republican plan reform, or at the very least not enough reform. It is, in my opinion, a very weak plan as opposed to what passed in the House. It's not enough to stop the downhill slide that health care costs are causing this country and its citizens.

To those of us backing the current plan, the Republican plan is hardly reform at all. As I posted before, we need affordable care that is portable, an end to arbitrary yearly and lifetime caps, and an end to refusal of insurance because of pre-existing conditions.

Anything less is a tweak, not a reform.

NJ
Well, we do agree on one thing. - Smitty
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I am all about choice. I am glad to see that you are pro-choice, too!
If you are for choice why do you support the bill - me
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Serious question here. How can you support a bill that is against choice when you say you are for choice?

This bill forces people. It does not give us the choice to do what we want.

I have a question - What should we do
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with those people who exercise their rights and choose not to purchase insurance (when they can very well afford it) and they show up at the hospital via ambulance/helicopter, etc.? Something major they cannot pay for? What do we do with those people?
You bill them just like what happened to me. - me
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It is a bill they end up paying just like I had to.

You didn't - get it
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Let's skip the part about it not being okay to borrow from nonprofit institutions and physicians....

I said "can't pay." Let's even go a step further for some added clarity. Let's say not only can the person not expect to be able to pay the bill within his/her lifetime, let's say now this unexpected occurrence has caused him/her to be disabled.
Yes I did get it, ok, then lets try this... - me
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Let's fix the part that's not broken. The whole health care system is not broken but they are screwing with it and soon it will be.

It is very unfortunate that there are certain people in those circumstances and they need a reasonable plan to help those people. I understand you perfectly and I have the deepest understanding and care for people in this situation. Sometimes it is of no fault that something serious like that happens to them. I understand if they can't pay and something should be done to help the less fortunate.

So...without any specific individual solutions, I'll just say that there has to be something worked out for special cases. Lets fix the areas that are broken right now - which is all the government run programs. If the government could show us that they can fix them then America would have a bit more confidence in giving them this new project. But they have screwed up so bad what they already have their paws in, that what they are now proposing is a total disaster that will mean the end to what is not broken.

There are a lot of parts of our health care system that needs work, but not a huge government overhaul on the whole system. Just like I wouldn't expect a 5th grader to do a complete overhaul of the engine in my vehicle, I don't think government should be touching the entire health care industry. They don't know what they are doing.

You still didn't - get it
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I am talking about people who could have paid for insurance coverage and did not. I don't know how much clearer I can make it.

People who exercise their right not to purchase insurance, end up at the hospital with some horrid accident that they now cannot pay for. They had the choice and the money to pay for insurance and did not.

I am not talking about someone who could not afford insurance. Do you think these irresponsible people should be "taken care of?"
I don't know what it is you want me to say - see message - me
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Seems you are only interested in one answer. The one you want or think is the right one. But you know what? There are a hundred different instances of things that could happen and every family/situation is different. It's not just black and white. It's tons of different colors.

I gave you an answer of billing the people who use the service and you didn't like that. You said how about people who can't pay or become disabled, so I gave you an honest compassionate answer about them and that I thought they could be helped, but it looks like you didn't like that either. Now your talking about a whole different situation, which goes to show you a million different possibilities of what could (or could not happen). My grandfather lived to be 93 years old. In his entire life he was in the hospital once for a broken wrist. You seem to think every person is going to end up in the hospital and not be able to pay for it.

Quite a few years ago I had an ectopic pregnancy and removal of ovary. My insurance covered some, but I didn't have any money to pay what the insurance company couldn't. They billed me and I paid the rest off each month until it was paid off. The hospital was understanding and knew things like this happen. They don't seem to have a problem with this. Only people who want to force a garbage plan on people have a problem with it because it doesn't fit into the plan you want.

For someone to use the excuse that they are not a financial institution, well you know what, something else could be worked out, like having a whole new industry (sort of like a credit card or bank), pay off the hospital bill and the patient pay back the bank instead of the hospital for the services. But you know what, I don't think you'll like that either. You want to force your beliefs that every citizen be forced to pay for insurance whether they can afford it or not, whether they are healthy or not, whether they believe in natural health care and have maintained a healthy lifestyle with that and by not going to physicians or for whatever reason.

There will always be a different circumstance for each person. Things can be worked out. Trying to play this "if they don't pay something they can't afford is irresponsible" role is a bunch of hogwash.

There is something called the constitution. It was written for a purpose. To protect the American people. I'm sorry you don't like that and think only your way is the right way. There are plenty of different alternatives that can be discussed, but you don't like any of them. Just yours and the liberals.

Not coming up with a better plan than the Pelosi-crap-care and forcing people to pay for something when they can't even afford to buy groceries or clothes for their kids is irresponsible.

Okay, you'll never - get it
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You want to be able to exercise your freedoms in taking advantage of others, and someone like that will never understand.
No you'll never get it - me
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Exercising my freedoms is a right I have here in America. That's why I live here in America, not a communist/socialist country like what you want. If I want what your talking about I will move to Cuba or Venezuela or a country like the kind you want. But I don't want that crap and that is why I am here. If you do maybe you should move there. But this is America and this is the life we want. If we wanted what you're describing we'd move there. What's next, you want to take away our freedoms of speech, freedom to worship whatever religion we want or don't want to worship. You might want to read up on the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Something most American believe in and hold dearly to our hearts.

This "taking advantage of others" is a bunch of hogwash. Me not purchasing insurance (which I have by the way) is not taking advantage of others. What a bunch of hooey. That bu!! aint gonna fly here honey.

No you're the one who doesn't understand. The only thing you want the Pelosi-crap-care plan and nothing else. You're not even interested in listening to other ideas or ways to make the health care system better. I'm sure you haven't even read anything the GOP has put together or their ideas. Your showing you don't care about the American way of life. Our freedoms or what other Americans in this country want. You don't understand the constitution, the Bill of Rights or anything that protects the American people. You only care about yourself and what your liberal pals are trying to enslave us with.

I have said I don't know how many times that there are other ways. Forcing people to buy something they cannot afford or don't believe in or want is unconstitutional.

If you were so concerned about the American people who don't have health insurance or don't like their health care plan you'd come with some ideas to fix that part of the system, but looks like you don't care about anyone without insurance. You don't care that people can't get insurance, you only care about what your pals want to enslave us with. Why I don't know cos you'll be right there with the rest of us. Who knows, maybe you're a multimillionaire and can afford to pay more taxes. I CAN'T!!! And neither can most of the country. American CANNOT afford that piece of crap they are trying to enslave us in.

But people like you will never understand.
I'm tired too - gourdpainter
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As you said, we have given up our rights one by one and will continue until there is nothing left. Obesity will undoubtedly be the next targeted group. But then people were so happy when smokers lost their right to smoke in public, right? No one should be "forced" to do anything. Any prudent person who can afford health care will likely purchase same. But it seems to me this proposed bill would basically tell people you WILL purchase health insurance and if you can't afford food...well, tough toenails!
Obesity should be targeted. - Slim Jim
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High blood pressure, high cholesterol, and high triglycerides, among many other health problems, are directly related to obesity. Personally, I would rather not foot the bill for people who have no self-control and eat fried food and sugary desserts until they are ready to burst? Maybe their money would be better spent on health insurance than junk food.
Sure another form of discrimination - just what we need - The Original Me
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by another member of the 'it's so easy to judge' congregation.

Are you also willing to curtail the ability of the junk food providers from advertising 24/7?
Personally I find - gourdpainter
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I find the sex and violence we are subjected to on TV to be extremely offensive and I think it is the ruination of the younger generation. That concerns me way more than people who smoke or are obese. But then the ground work is already being laid to take away the right to choose what we eat. Surely some freedom will be taken from "slim jim" sooner or later that he/she will squall like a wounded panther about.
Well since there is so much sex and violence on TV - me
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Why don't we just take away everyone's TV. Or have all those shows canceled. After all according to some people who think people should control what obese people eat, why not also control what shows people can and cannot watch.

Good for America right?
Now taking away the tv wouldn't bother me - gourdpainter
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Awhile back while browsing through used books in a flea market I came across a fiction book "Left Behind." I bought it for 50 cents. It was such a good read I ordered the other books in the series. I like reading novels that COULD be true (like I've read all of John Grisham's books). Anyhow, it is quite sobering to read this series "Left Behind" because while it is fiction, as it progresses one can and does see things already happening similarly.
Well, I guess, the mighty O has decided to - MTfromLA
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start by banning Fox News Channel.
Has a point, though. I work with diabetics. This has quadrupled - -mostly due to obesity..facts are facts.nm
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nm
This is now getting a little too lets just say Hitler-oriented. - me
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I'm glad you're so perfect that you can judge others. Also make sure you embarrass the heck out of em in public to, after all they are obese, they don't have any feelings. Maybe you should assign a person to them 24 hours a day to make sure they don't eat anything you don't approve of.
risks - linda
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Have you looked at the linebackers lately? maybe sports should be banned because of injuries. How about runners? Recommendations are starting to change because of the impact wear and tear of joints. Car wrecks? Give up cars? Sunbathers? skateboarders? ban alcohol? drugs are banned and that has not changed anything. Ban sex, too, while we are at it.

consequences - gourdpainter

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Then I think they should be set up on a reasonable payment plan and treated as any other debt.
Where will the money to loan them - come from?
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Where does it come from now since that's the way it is now? Hospitals are not in the business of lending money. The other customers have to absorb those costs while the debt is being paid. What happens if they are unable to pay it? What happens if they can never work again and cannot pay? How is that cost absorbed? Who pays for that?
It might just work - gourdpainter
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If hospitals went back to being NOT FOR PROFIT.
I guess every last one of us - should exercise our
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right to go without insurance and see what happens then.
If that's what you want to do - me
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That is why we live in the greatest country. The Constitution, Declaration of Independence, Bill of Rights, and other documents were written to protect us.

Me, I think it's silly not to have some type of coverage. But I'm not pushing what I choose to do on other people.

You also asked where the money will come from (or maybe somebody else asked). The money will come from the same places it comes from when people get a loan to buy a car, a home, purchase items on credit cards. Where does that money come from? It doesn't just materialize from thin air.

At least the Hospitals in this country have compassionate for the people and they always work things out.

me

democracy - linda

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I figured it's like this: Democracy is about majority rule. Socialism is about rule the majority.

2.5% of a $15K annual salary is $375 dollars (tax) - The original me

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Per YOUR post: The JCT letter makes clear that Americans who do not maintain âacceptable health insurance coverageâ and who choose not to pay the billâs new individual mandate tax (generally 2.5% of income).

So that's where I got the $375 figure.

Anyone who would refuse the lowest cost health policy OR the $375 fine is plainly stoopid.

I don't agree with a jail term but even though this may be an accurate reading of the House bill, it will NOT pass the Senate.

So your post is just a page out of the HOW TO FRIGHTEN AMERICANS INTO OPPOSING HEALTH CARE REFORM.

Chapter and verse.

P.S. - the original me

[ In Reply To ..]
To clarify I just used $15,000 salary as an example.

For a 25,000 salary, the 2.5% figure would be $625.

I would just really love to the see the group of people who would refuse the lowest cost health care plan, AND refuse to pay the tax instead. Something tells me this group would fit an elevator.

As I see it - the 'tax' is what the government is assessing people who REFUSE to insure themselves since they will eventually require health care.
That said, I am not a huge fan of a tax *penalty,* so hoping the Senate version clears this aspect of the reform.

2.5% - anon

[ In Reply To ..]
The 2.5% tax does sound affordable. . but what will it pay for? Will you still have to pay %50 every time you see a doctor? $10 for every prescription? If so, it will not help the poor, struggling to get by working people who are trying to live on $15,000-20,000 per year. It will be a burden.
My thoughts, too. How can someone making $15,000 per year - even feed themselves? nm
[ In Reply To ..]
nm
It depends on what part of the country you live in. - me
[ In Reply To ..]
Depending on what part of the country you live in. If you had 12K a year, that's 1K a month. If your rent is $300 that leaves $700 for bills. If you have no debt and just your basic living costs it can be done. Also, there are all kinds of programs for the less fortunate (food stamps, etc). People can live on 15K a year.

The country will run out of jail space before it runs out of people who won't pay. NM - Mo MT

[ In Reply To ..]
No message

nobody is going to jail - ssmt

[ In Reply To ..]
The jail myth is just that, a myth.

"Under the bill, the only people who would face the fee for not purchasing insurance are those who can truly afford to purchase such insurance.

For a small number of people who might refuse to pay the fee, it is important to remember that, in the majority of cases, the IRS â which will enforce the insurance requirement â uses the CIVIL process to settle delinquent penalties and taxes."

You can find this at the link below.

Thhis is what I found - it states otherwise - anon

[ In Reply To ..]
I did some searching and found the following link. The title is "You will go to Jail under the Pelosi Health Care Bill if You Don't Buy the Government Option."

In the link is an official memo from Congress of the United States dated 11/5/09, addressed to the Honorable Dave Camp. On page 3, two bullets under criminal penalties (right at the top).

Bullet #1 states:

"Section 7203 - misdemeanor willful failure to pay is punishable by a fine of up to $25,000 and/or imprisonment of up to one year".

Bullet #2 states:

"Section 7201 - felony willful evasion is punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 and/or imprisonment of five years".

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/15141066/You-Will-Go-To-Jail-Under-the-Pelosi-Health-Care-Bill-If-You-Dont-Buy-The-Government-Option

I don't know about you, but that to me states that if I don't buy the government option (i.e. Pelosi-crap-care_ I will be going to jail and fined more money than I would make in a lifetime.

At least that's what the memo looks like to me.

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