A community of 30,000 US Transcriptionist serving Medical Transcription Industry

Transgender teacher returns

Posted: Mar 24, 2014

Interesting...

;

Good for her! - nm

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nm

I agree! - :)

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x

Meh.... - sm

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I don't know....seems like everyone is supposed to for everything or else they're labeled as a bigot or something. I'm not that for this. Pull it together by the time you're in your 50s and I'm pretty sure turning into a woman is not the answer. I'm not against the guy and I wish him the best of luck, but should he be teaching children, I guess I just don't know???

If the individual in question is capable of doing their job well--sm - anon

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then they should be allowed to do it even if the gender they self-identify with does not correlate with the one they were born with. Situations such as this provide learning opportunities.

Not a "her," not a woman, biological sex cannot be changed - wheres_my_job

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As a medical transcriptionist (ex) and as a person who believes in science, I am anti-creationism - whether that's for life on earth, or in this particular case, a biological male undergoing cosmetic surgery and hormone treatment, and somehow "becoming a woman" thereby.

Woman = biological female of human species, adult.
Man = biological male of human species, adult.
Transgender = ka-ching! Big bucks for surgeons, endocrinologists and psychologists - "transgender" is a CHRONIC condition, requiring LIFELONG hormone treatment and surgery on male to create neovagina - LIFELONG dilation.
There are female transgender individuals as well.

This man's reference to a list of activities he considers "hypermasculine" is hyperSEXIST. There's nothing he's done that women can't do, and there is nothing he is doing NOW, that is not consistent with being a man, with a biological male's gender expression. Proof? He's doing it!

I think this is a terrible example to set for children in the school setting - hey kids! Like to do something that most kids of your gender aren't doing! Gosh, instead of being an individual with individual tastes and interests, you may be transgender - need hormones and surgery! Or - hey kids! Are you lesbian or gay? No, forget that - you're just in the WRONG BODY, so we'll switch THAT around (with hormones and surgery) and that way you can be straight, the way mommy and daddy so desperately want you to be!

This whole transgender narrative is sexist and anti-woman. I totally support him wearing anything he wants, do what he wants to his body - but just don't call yourself, and expect others to pretend, that you are now a "woman." Total male fantasy and delusion. Although there are women who have surgery and hormones and they think that makes them men.

I'm anti-homophobia and anti-sexism. I'm anti-discrimination for transgender people. But I'm also PRO my right to call it like I see it. And what I'm seeing is a throwback to the worst sexist stereotypes imaginable.

Great post. Couldn't have said it better. - However, I will say this

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I would have more respect for the person if he kept his personal life to himself. There was no reason for the big "ta-da. Look at me everyone". If this is what he wants to do with this life fine, but to parade it around is just wrong.

You wrote an excellent post.

If you read the article - you would know

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That she wanted to keep it quiet; however, the school and school board made a bid deal about it.

I read the article. He could have told the school and board no - He didn't want to bring

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attention to himself. They didn't force him to do this. He had a say in what he wanted to happen.

Trying to keep it hidden would do more harm than good. - People would think they were correct to be fearful

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Being open and honest is the first step towards - ending fear & discrimination.

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"Open and honest" is a two-way street - wheres_my_job

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If people disagree with the reasoning behind the belief that one can change one's biological sex (as opposed to simply believing one can accept or reject gender stereotypes as they see fit, which I HEARTILY ENDORSE)- they have a right to say so, and be heard, by policymakers and legislators.

I really don't care what people wear or how they "present" themselves. I DO care how someone's belief that they can change into the opposite sex affects laws and policy, that may end up being to the detriment of women - that is, adult females.

Well, I think I am a - Linda

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rhinoceros. That doesn't mean I am one.

You were responding to the post above mine, right? - wheres_my_job

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I mean, I think we're on the same page...

The same page of discrimination. - Discrimination is immoral.

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Disagreeing does not equal discrimination - wheres_my_job

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I am against discrimination for ANYBODY. Disagreeing that you can change your biological sex through hormones, surgery, and/or simply "believing deep inside" that you are the opposite sex, is not discriminating against everyone. Reasonable people disagree. They sometimes disagree vehemently. This is not the same as discrimination in housing, jobs, voting, etc.

Linda's response to WMJ - Linda

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Yep. I am on the same page as you are. You know what they say, political correctness is intellectual terrorism.

But in a free country, you should have every - right to try your best to be one, no?

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Would you REALLY want the government or your boss to say you couldn't try your best to be one, if that's what you truly wanted, and it didn't affect how you did your job? We all have a right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness in this country, and I don't think that should be struck down by anyone. And certainly not in the name of *religious beliefs*.

You're wrong. They're not changing their biological - sex when assigned wrong one in the 1st place.

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And even if they do, it's not an evil thing to do. It's not a "sin". The "sin" is when other people judge them for it. We have no more right to judge them for doing something they feel is necessary, than the government or large corporations have any right to tell them (or women of child-bearing age) what to do with their bodies.

LOL - I'm not saying it's evil or a "sin" - wheres_my_job

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I'm saying it's IMPOSSIBLE, both things are impossible:

A) Changing one's biological sex

and

B) That transgender individuals have been assigned biological sex incorrectly at birth.

No, they were identified as having male genitalia at birth correctly (in the case of men wanting to be women, the example of the OP).

What is being "wrongly assigned" (to use your terminology) is the overblown importance attached to gender stereotypes - which many groups do - I'm thinking religious fundamentalists of all stripes, for one. I really don't care what a man wears, or how he "behaves" or "performs," or what he does to his body - I may judge it a waste of money, but then again, I think almost everyone makes judgments about whether the money spent is worth whatcha got as a result - but I DO care that they expect everyone else (ie, actual women) to behave as if they are now somehow transformed into actual biological females (which again, is what the word "woman" refers to).

Let's stay reality-based, shall we? It's interesting, the parallel between republican talking points/Tea Party rhetoric and trans rhetoric - none of which, to my mind, are reality-based.

Biological sex is a material fact of life - gender (expression, performance, behavior) is what changes. So men are trying to expand what is acceptable presentation/behavior in men - well good on them. Just don't call that process "becoming a woman." It reminds me of the fairy tale "The Emperor's New Clothes" - all the people telling the emperor how good he looked in his new clothes. Well, it's the same thing - people telling men how FEMALE they look in THEIR new clothes (after surgery, new hormones ingested, dresses, etc). You're STILL men. And this is democracy, and you're not emperors. School district might be going along with this whole thing, to avoid lawsuits. End of story.

Here's another thought - CJ

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First we tolerate
Then we accept
Then we embrace

NO!

That all depends - sm

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I can tolerate anything as long as it's not thrown in my face with the statement you WILL tolerate.

I accept people for who they are and so do most everyone else unless they are told/ordered you WILL tolerate.

I embrace people who are deserving of being embraced and as long as they don't stink.

Those are not things you force on people. Not everyone tolerates, accepts and embraces and that's fine. It's their life. It is nobody's place to force their beliefs onto other people.

If there were something about YOU that others - discriminated against, you would -

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probably be very hurt by it. It's sad that you can't see discrimination from the other person's point of view.

Discrimination is material-based - wheres_my_job

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Jobs, housing, voting and so on. See: Civil Rights Movement in US.

That someone believes they can change their biological sex, and you don't believe they can (see: science and theory of evolution, sexually-reproducing species, etc), is not the latter person "discriminating" against the former. So the former's "feelings" are hurt. Discrimination as a legal matter is not about "feelings."

I have been discriminated against. Life goes on - those people are not important to me

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I like myself for who I am and so do my friends and family. I could care less what some stranger thinks of me or says of me. More important things in life than trying to please everyone.

It is not a requirement in life that every person accepts everyone else.

That's too bad. Your narrowmindedness means - you will be missing out on - SM

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all the good things that many people have to offer, simply because they happen to think differently than you do.

Yes, I DO tolerate, accept, and embrace all my gay and transgender friends for the beautiful people they truly are.

Being born with an INDETERMINATE SEX is not - as uncommon as you might think.

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It happens fairly frequently, and the doc makes a judgment call about what the sex is LIKELY to be.

Also, sometimes it's not that cut and dried; the genitalia may be female, but the brain may be male. And yes, there are male and female brains.

It takes a great deal of courage for a person to realize they just aren't what people think they are, and to be true to themselves and identify with the other sex instead. It has nothing to do with "morality", or lack thereof.

I commend people who have the courage to do what is best in their own heart, because it often means a difficult and sometimes lonely road ahead. I would rather my child be taught by a person who is wise and resilient enough to know themselves to such an extent, and not by someone who wants them to "conform to the norm."

You're talking to medical transcriptionists here - wheres_my_job

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Wow. No, it does NOT happen "fairly frequently," these mysterious "judgment calls" re: identifying biological sex at birth.

And no, the men who believe they are "really women" are not a case of intersex. Intersex people distance themselves from the whole trans movement.

It's not courage to be confused about sex and gender. It's courage to be a man, choose to dress how you want, behave how you want, and claim that for your OWN version of masculinity - NOT conforming to gender stereotypes, that is, gender NORMS, and ASSUME you must be a woman if you like/dress/behave etc a certain way.

Get your logic right. Having a lot of emotion on a subject does not make you right.

posting on an MT board when you've left the field - does not make you an MT NM

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once an MT, always an MT - wheres_my_job

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LOL - and nobody else on this board is an MT either?

have a good night.

What a mean-spirited person you are. - Glad you dont live next door.

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LOL - facts make a person "mean-spirited" - wheres_my_job

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I live in reality, so maybe...it's not possible for us to live "next door?"

Have a good night.

Well, one would THINK I'm talking to MTs here, - but sometimes it seems like just bigots to me.

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Seems and is are often too different things - wheres_my_job

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Just because someone disagrees with your beliefs, does not make them a bigot - just because someone doesn't believe in Christian tenets, or Muslim, or Buddhist, does not mean they are bigoted against those religions. They just don't believe.

In the same way, my disbelief that it is possible for humans to change biological sex is not bigotry. It's my understanding of science, evolution, DNA, sexual reproduction. It's also my understanding that in the field of psychology, there have been (and apparently will continue to be) fashionable theories that are more responses to social tensions and conflicts, rather than anything having to do with reality (testable, reproducible scientific results). I think the idea of "brain sex" is going to end up in the same "dustbin of history" as the concept of "penis envy."
(See: Freud, the whole sorry (and sexist) story of his research).

So do you feel the same way about women who - become men? Because

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you are only talking about men changing sex.

OP's comment was regarding a man - wheres_my_job

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I believe that biological sex cannot be changed in humans. That goes for women too.

Thanks for clarifying, I actually forgot - what the OP was about

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after reading all the comments.

I appreciate your posts, but I gotta say, this is the first time I've ever disagreed with you.

We're all entitled to our opinions - wheres_my_job

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Me, you, everyone. I just found out there's a new book coming out on this topic, called "Gender Hurts." Should be an interesting read.

I'm actually writing a piece about something else, and maybe I'll throw in a paragraph or two about the trans phenomenon. So I like hearing everyone's opinion.

I appreciate your posts too, but unlike the poster you replied to - I have to say

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This is the first time I've agreed with you 100% on everything you wrote. Your posts are well written and thoroughly researched.

Now if we could only agree on political issues. LOL

Absolutely. Look at Chaz Bono. Finally seems - comfortable in his own skin. For - sm

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the longest time, while he was growing up and was a "girl", you could see the discomfort written all over.

"Becoming a man" - the ultimate "Anti-Cher" possible - wheres_my_job

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Could it be possible there were other, less invasive, less drastic ways of Chastity becoming her own woman, in the face of her mother's...I don't even know what to call it - let's just call it show biz success, dressed in one Bob Mackie fashion extravaganza after another? That must be a tough act to follow, for a daughter...

That's another problem with transgender rhetoric - it closes off the possibility of OTHER solutions to the painful feelings, self-hatred, etc, that transgender claim can ONLY be solved by some mythical "transition" to the opposite sex.

Chaz is still a woman, even after surgery and her (now) lifelong need to take hormones. No doubt she feels better, being "her own person" and all, TOTALLY distinct from Cher's version of being a woman.

There are only a million ways of being a woman...or a man! It's unfortunate that culturally, we can't seem to wrap our heads around this, and encourage individual expression that doesn't require cutting off body parts and hormones.

I work in pathology and I believe - genetic testing and chromosomal

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analysis are ussed to determined which gender is dominant. It is not common at out hospital, but it does happen.

biological gender and sex indentification are not the same - nm

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There is no such thing as "biological gender" - wheres_my_job

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Gender is social, transactional, cultural - NOT biological. It is something HUMANS layer onto biological reality. "Biological gender" is an oxymoron.

Biological sex is identified at birth - or before birth via ultrasound (maybe there are other methods in use). GENDER is how the parents and other caregivers, teachers, etc, etc choose to interact with the individual - and vice versa.

This whole notion of "identification" with one's sex is problematic - what you're really saying is, whether an individual identifies with the STEREOTYPES or NORMS associated with one's biological sex. These stereotypes are mutable - changeable - malleable in the face of social pressure for change - for example, women wearing pants. Are women who wear pants therefore "less feminine" or "men?" Of course not. That holds true for men who are wearing clothing stereotypically associated with women.

We have biological sex identified at birth (or before). We all identify AND DIS-identify with gender stereotypes - this is not something exclusive to people who think they are the opposite sex.

perhaps I could say it the other way around - sm

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Maybe I could express it better by saying: biological sex and gender identification are not the same. I think you make a really interesting point about gender roles, and I agree with you on many points. Still, it seems to me that a man who enjoys knitting is quite different from a man who prefers to behave as a female.

Wow, that's a classic statement - wheres_my_job

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You say: "Still, it seems to me that a man who enjoys knitting is quite different from a man who prefers to behave as a female."

I have no idea WHAT "behave as a female" is supposed to mean - besides a conglomeration of sexist stereotypes, that may or may not include knitting. Hmm, Amelia Earhart flying airplane...behaving as a female, or no? Random woman rockin' a pair of tight jeans? Men can rock tight jeans too. Etc..... Seems like you're saying if a man engages in some arbitrary threshold of stereotypical "feminine" behaviors (like 316 stereotypical behaviors of women!) then he becomes a woman...sort of like earning badges when you're a Boy Scout, and then you get enough, you become an Eagle Scout....um, no.

"Gender identification" is a meaningless term. Can you define it? Without resorting to sexist stereotypes. Give it a shot. I'm all earharts, I mean, ears...

Wow, what a sad and closed-off little world - you must live in.

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I don't live in a sad and closed-off world - wheres_my_job

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but thank you for your concern.

More creeped-out than concerned, actually. - n/m

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Being "creepd out" is silly - wheres_my_job

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LOL. Have a nice day, you can do it!

Last word much? - Like maybe always?

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;p

I disagree with WMJ, but I'd want to address - it too, if someone

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said I creeped them out.

Why does it matter so much to you what another - human being believes about their gender?

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If you're happy with your own gender, then that should be enough. What other people may be going through is really none of your concern.

It's called "law" and "policy" - wheres_my_job

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I don't think anyone is 100% "happy" with the gender stereotypes assigned to their biological sex. This is a big problem with the trans rhetoric - it claims people who are NOT transgender are therefore "happy" with "gender." It's a lot more complicated than that.

It is obviously a concern when ANY rhetoric is being used as a basis for changes in laws and policies. Laws and policies can have unintended (or perhaps not so unintended) consequences. Should violent male sexual offenders, who claim to be females, or in the process of becoming females, be housed in women's prisons? Is that fair to women prisoners? This is a matter of law and policy, not someone's personal feelings or actions.

MTs, of all people, should know that "law" and - "policy" are very often corrupt.

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Exactly - which is why we need to pay attention to them - wheres_my_job

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Transgender is not simply an "identity" taken on by individuals. It is also the basis for changes in laws and policy. I would say the transgender policies being put in place are harmful to women and children - elementary school age children have enough sophistication to understand adult sexuality? Because that's what you are impacting, when you start putting kids on hormones and/or perform surgery. Maybe the kid is just lesbian or gay - leave them alone, see what happens. Instead putting them on the transgender pathway, where hormones and surgery are a given. What if they change their mind when they are 20, about a "decision" they were guided into by (I feel misguided) parents, educators and health-care professionals? I see lawsuits coming out of this, from kids who will grow into adults who will feel this transgender thing was child abuse inflicted upon them, when they were too young to understand the consequences and give consent.

Consent - a legal term.

Last word again? Sure, beat everyone down - who is open-minded.

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Apparently, we're BOTH competing for the last word - wheres_my_job

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It takes 5 seconds to drop in here, post something, and leave. Why not? If I see a crooked picture hanging on the wall, I might take 5 seconds to straighten that as well. No biggie.

Have a nice day. LOL.

why does it have to be a competition? - what is the prize?

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Domination of the board? Voted the least popular MT ever in the history of the world? FYI, there is more than one person on the board who thinks your need to make a final comment pushes you into the category of overbearing. Try not to make a final comment. Just try. I have faith that you could not hold your tongue (fingers) if someone dangled a $10k carrot in front of your nose to just be quiet.

Laughter fills the air - it's only 5 seconds of my time! - wheres_my_job

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Find joy in life - well, I guess that's what we're both doing. LOL.

That's pretty much how I feel. I don't care. I just - want people to be happy.

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Even if I don't understand it, I know better than to assume I know what's right for someone else.

You just want people to be happy? - CJ

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Your attitude smacks of moral relativism.

Huh? - nm

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.

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