A community of 30,000 US Transcriptionist serving Medical Transcription Industry

Some thoughts about this board, etc.

Posted: Mar 18, 2012

I respect everyone’s right to their opinions. We have a 2-party system in this country, thankfully, although at times I wish it were more, and if we all thought the same, or weren’t allowed to disagree, we would probably not be living in a democracy. This is my issue. When I hear, for example, some conspiracy theory on how Obama’s (or it could be anyone) agenda is to ruin the country, turn it into a socialist state (which by the way Medicare, Social Security, Aid to Dependent Children, subsidies for farmers, the list goes on and on, are all socialist derivatives and we seem to be okay with those, more or less) or some other rather radical idea, I immediately check in on a certain conservative “news” station to see what their talking point d’jour might be. Yes, I am focusing on that station and that station in particular because it is the biggest perpetrator of untruths, even though it would only be fair to note the others have their own agendas. If we all go only to the media that expounds on our own ideology (and there are independent sites like Fair.org and others if we care to find them) we are only stroking any fear-based ideas we may have, robbing ourselves of the truth…and the truth can have more than 1 side or even 2… and when we repeat an unfounded statement as if it is gospel, we lose credibility, our cause looses credibility, and we appear pitifully ignorant (because we really are and that should not be confused with stupid as some individuals like to throw around on this board). Just my opinion for whatever its worth and I’m sure many will think it’s worthless but, nonetheless, there it is.

;

Status of this board.. - anon

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I don't think your opinion is worthless at all. It actually a very intelligent response to "socialist thinking" People truly confuse of directly associate socialism with communism. Huge difference. Not only are Medicare, Social Security, etc., socialist derivatives, but so are policemen, fire fighters, teachers, road crews, etc. All of these are paid by imposed taxes. So unless all of us want to pave our own roads, police our own cities, fight our own fires, etc., some "socialism" is a necessity.

what's not to like about this post? - like

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My thoughts about your post - anony2

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Everyone has an opinion and has the right to their opinions. Everyone reads different sites and watches different news stations. It's all preference and who do people like listening to. I know what station you are talking about (Fox - no need to be cryptic). I myself don't watch it. I don't like the commentators/shows. I don't feel like I'm getting the truth. Just what they want to put out. On the same hand I also don't watch MSNBC or CNN because I also feel like I'm not getting the truth and I don't like their commentators/shows. There is really no TV news station I trust, therefore I get my news from different sites on the internet. But what I have seen on this board has been very bad lately. People cutting down others for their opinion. Ridiculed if they don't tow the party line, and slapped in the face with "stop watching Faux", etc. As though their opinion is more important than others. I've seen a lot of good posters leave the board because they are tired of being ridiculed and posters bullying and ganging up on them, ridiculing them when their concerns are legitimate. I've seen the board go from being a decent place to have a conversation and share information (about 2 or so years ago), now to one side trying to take over the board and bullying those who don't agree with them.

Now, as for your opinion on conspiracy theories. People are voicing their opinion here because of what they see happening in government. These are not conspiracy theories. If you love Obama then of course you are not going to see it. But if your independent and you see the policies they are setting forth and trying to pass are indeed socialist policies then you have the right as a taxpayer (and poster on this board) to voice your opinion without being called nasty names. When I see the radical ideas being pushed. When the promises to help the middle and low income are not met, but he bails out his banker, CEO, and wall street buddies then yes I have the right to be upset. I voted for him based on the campaign promises he made. He fooled the lot of us. Policies being set forth, bills being passed, etc are not untruths. Obama is a nice guy. He's personable and I like him. I voted for him, I believed in him. But everything I see and read and hear with my own ears and eyes things that he says and does, that hope he promised us is gone. It's three years later and I'm still waiting for that hope. My sister and her family who just lost their house. The aid they were promised. Is all gone. Now I'm taking her and her family in until they can get back on their feet. When you realize he is doing nothing to help us, that's when you have to just step back and look at the situation objectively. And just because I don't agree with everything he says and does doesn't mean I listen or watch any specific rag on TV or listen to any hate-filled radio stations.

People are reading, watching, and listening. When we hear with our own ears the attorney general saying it's okay to assassinate American citizens in our own country for any reason they want to or jail them without due process and not let them have a lawyer or call their family. When I hear the government has set up website for citizens to turn in others if they think they are telling something false about Obama and the administration. Then that just really has to make you wonder. When I read the background of all his czars and find out some are devoted communists and the speeches they are giving are trying to convince the audience that we need a communistic country, and I'm hearing this myself as are others, then you really have to step back and look at things objectively. Is this really what you want. If it is then you should stand up and not be afraid to say so. My cousin even thinks the only way that people of the country will survive is to become a socialist country. Of course she doesn't have much of anything and believes the rich should share their wealth with all the low income people so that everyone will be equal. If that's what you want then you shouldn't be afraid to say so. But not hide it secretly wanting it to be so, but afraid to say something. I learned a long time ago from an SSG in the Army that if you believe in something never be afraid to say so. Just make sure you know why it is you believe that.

You have now taken your opinion and tried to slam anyone who doesn't think or believe what you do by calling them conspiracy theories or untruths, not credible, etc. Yes, we are all entitled to our opinions, but it doesn't mean the truths that you don't want to believe are not true. Too much is going on in the country for it just to be ignored because people love Obama. Heck I love the guy (the man, husband and father). Always thought if I was in an emergent situation his voice would be very reassuring. There is nothing not to like about him (the man). Very handsome too. Looks good in a tux and has a nice singing voice. But his politics I don't like. I used to like him when he was a senator (probably because I really didn't know his political viewpoints and what he wants to accomplish, etc). But as president it's all very clear now. It's just not what I believe and want for my family and friends and others in the country who are low income trying to survive, and not what the country is founded on. When you even have other world leaders telling him not to lead the country in that direction because it never ends up well (and they should know). Then that does have to make you wonder.

And that is my opinion.

anony2 - Conservative

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Although I do not agree with what you said to a large degree about Obama and thinking he was a good man, I do appreciate the honesty. I never liked him or his policies and I dislike him more now. Obama is intellectually dishonest and treats the American public as if they are stupid morons and needs his "fatherly guidance" and government oppression to keep us from harming ourselves; nothing could be further from the truth. His policies will ultimately breed more harm and destroy any hope of a strong America. Unfortunately, several on this board seem to relish that thought and drool at the chops waiting for it. They do not seem to realize that they will be on the short end of that, as will the American public at large. Personally, I think his motives are evil and self-serving. If Obama was as intelligent as his supporters claim (I do not believe Obama is that intelligent), then Obama should be able to see the distress, heartache and destruction communist and socialist countries suffered and the devastating abuse their citizens suffered on several levels. Anyone seeking communism and socialism shows just how evil they are. Most have no idea that Obama's cabinet is riddled with communists, hand-picked by Obama himself, that want nothing more than to destroy America and that saddest part of all, the ones that do know, just don't care because the Dems are in the White House. This does not benefit the country and certainly not the inhabitants. Unfortunately, most of the posters on his board have absolutely no understanding of communism and socialism and have no interest in getting at the truth. Sad for them; very danger for us all.

Okay, I agree with you. - anony2

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I was thinking of campaign Obama when I was writing. I thought he was a decent person, I really liked him and believed in him. But you have reminded me of what's been happening. I too think he is intellectually dishonest (which is very different from being an intellectual). He does treat the Americans as if they are stupid and mean nothing to him (except when he lies to them to get their votes). I think he can be a very personable man to some. There have been times when he's given speeches and I like him, but then other times when he lies and you have to sit rolling your eyes.

I agree with everything else you said and the statement of people don't care because a Dem is in the white house is definitely a good observation. My grandpa used to say the democrats would vote in a dog just to not have a republican in. I see it here a lot. They don't care that the country is failing, that unemployment is on the rise and that people across the country are losing their homes and have no hope for a future because as long as a dem is in the office that's all they care about.

Thanks for reminding me. I guess the handsome man in him made me forget what he is really like. I think his cabinet members and Ayers/Dorn couple really show what he is like and where he wants to lead the country. People need to be smarter this election. Don't vote for someone who supports and is guided by people like that just because they are in your club (party), pick someone who has the best interest of the people in the country and who can fix the problems or at least start to fix the problems. Not someone who keeps bowing to other countries leaders and tells other countries how greedy, selfish, and stupid we are. Vote for someone who tells other countries we are a great country filled with great people and is proud of us and someone who will lead the country in the right direction. And for Pete's sake do not have a SofS that tells the country we need to be more like Venezuela.

It is very said AND very dangerous.

anony2 - Conservative

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I want to personally thank you for such dignified responses with all posters, even if you disagree with what they wrote. It is refreshing to see your posts that actually address the issues and concerns without the snotty, snarky comments so common on here that some post when another poster does not agree with everything Obama.

I really hope you continue to post. You are quite an asset to this board.

I think you read a whole lot more into my post - sm

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than was there but that's okay. It was not my intention to “slam” anyone who doesn’t agree with me. I just don’t see this as a struggle between good and evil, between the demise of our country or its salvation. It’s a political campaign for power and the politicians, the news media and the talking heads all have a different point at which they draw the line as to what is responsible and what is not, what is fair game and what is not, and what they can get away with saying and what they can’t. Some draw that line closer to the truth than others and some have a vested interest that is not in the American people’s best interest but rather for their own personal and professional gain. Some throw around phrases like “war on women,” and while I think there are tremendously serious issues regarding women’s health at hand and we should be very concerned about this, I’m not entirely sure it’s a war. Some of them easily toss aspersions about the President throwing into question his citizenship and even when his birth certificate was produced the idea was still promoted repeatedly because they know that if they repeat it enough, some people will believe it and run with it. I just think we need to ask ourselves where we personally draw the line. I just don’t think we should be so willing to believe anything we hear, repeat it wantonly, call somebody else stupid because they don’t agree or in any other way insult them, and at the same time take no personal responsibility in at least trying to find out if what we have so vigorously and sincerely repeated and promoted is a political ploy, part of somebody’s personal or professional agenda, or if it indeed has legitimacy. And believe me, I know I am not above falling for some nonsense that plays on my fears or special interests. I am struggling to rise above it and I certainly don’t consider myself some pillar of truth and justice or that I know anymore than anyone else. That’s about all I have to say on this.

You think so? I don't. Here, let me explain... - anony2

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I like that you said you respect everyone's opinion and that you are thankful we have a 2 party system. I agree with that.

But then you went into claiming things are a conspiracy theory about how Obama wants to turn the country into a socialist state. These are not conspiracy theories. There are many conspiracy theories out there, but just because you don't agree with the policies being set forth that doesn't qualify it to be a conspiracy theory.

It is a power struggle that's for sure and while you say the news media and talking heads all have a different point at wich they draw the line as to what is responsible and what is not I also know you are talking about Fox and Rush, but on the other hand you have MSNBC who goes too far with some of the things they say and sometimes they do not know when they have gone too far. That's why I don't listen to any of them. I don't need any TV news station whether it be liberal or conservative putting out their opinions as though they are truth. All the news stations have a vested interest. If I do hear things (and should be for anyone else too) they need to listen, but then do research. Read things from sites you normally wouldn't because you know what, sometimes we all believe things should be a certain way, but what if we're wrong. I've done that many times. Like religion for example. I believe so strongly growing up things were a certain way. Then I'd hear things here and there that made me question whether or not I was wrong about a certain issue. For me it's the same way with politics. I've changed my mind on many issues learning that I was wrong about an issue. It's what helps us grow. My cousin will never admit she's wrong. Even when facts are presented to her. She doesn't want to hear it.

My other issue that I took as a slam to conservatives (and of course I could be wrong), but when you wrote - "and when we repeat an unfounded statement as if it is gospel, we lose credibility, our cause looses credibility, and we appear pitifully ignorant (because we really are and that should not be confused with stupid as some individuals like to throw around on this board)." I've read a lot of posts here with people (conservatives) posting their opinion on things they have heard and read, but it doesn't mean the statement is unfounded or they are ignorant. They have some serious questions and issues about something happening. That is what I took as a slam to people who don't agree with you. Of course I could be wrong.

People have concerns about issues. They have concerns about the policies. They have concerns about things Obama or other people in the cabinet say. They have concerns about it being okay to assassinate Americans. They have concerns about the SoS saying our country needs to be like another country that is communist or that certain czars and known communists. They also have concerns about other issues and why we haven't been shown legitimate documents. And they don't like being called stupid or ignorant or un-American or conspiracy theorists, or people who wear tin foil hats all because they don't agree with them.

That's what I was trying to say. And that again is my opinion.

Yes I think so and this is why. - sm

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You just really dont get it. My posts were lost on you. You seem to believe you have all the answers. Good for you. Im still trying to figure out the real questions. P.S. I do not look forward to another 5 paragraph diatribe on why you are right and I am wrong, but go for it if you must. As for me, I wont be reading it. It will only be more of the same.

Wow that's what you got out of her post - that's very sad.... - what if

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That posters that are not libs cannot explain their viewpoints or feelings or experiences without a liberal coming back to trash them, accuse them of things they didn't write.

By reading her posts it looks like she understood your posts very well. She never did say she had all the answers, but evidently you think you do and won't even listen or allow others to have a different point of view than you.

Also, reading her posts she never said she was right and you were wrong. But evidently you think you are. Hence the snotty reply. Its painfully obvious that libs have no tolerance for others that share a different point of view than they do. It sounds like she was trying to explain why she and others are suffering under democrat rule. If people don't like reading others opinions that don't align with yours I think the moderator has made it pretty clear to just don't read those posts. And I'm sure she really don't care whether or not you read her posts. She has as much right to post as the rest of us do. Her posts were respectful.

But that's the problem with libs. They can't stand anyone with a different opinion then them and will have to try and cut down and call republicans and independents and anyone not in the democrat party stupid and ignorant. Guess that makes them feel good.

I hope Obama loses this next election. Under his reign many people are losing their homes. More people are being laid off from work and unemployment is on the rise. Jobs are going oversees. The economy is getting worse. We're going to wars without congresses approval, etc, etc. He is dividing the country instead of uniting like he promised when he was campaign Obama. He's got neighbors fighting with neighbors over what? politics. One group calling another ignorant and stupid by raising holy you know what if its said back to them. When an employee at a company fails at his job they are fired. This is no different. He is an employee of the corporation. If the country has any chance of getting out of the ditch we are in, which is now the size of a crater, we must get out from under democratic rule. It's the only way people will prosper and not just the 1%ers, his wall street buddies and CEO buddies.

If she didn't want to hear a different opinion she should have just said so - anony2

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in her message. Where she came up with what she wrote I have no idea. I guess she must have been taken aback that there are people with a different opinion than hers. That are actually seeing what is happening to the country. Still don't know where she came up with "you are right and I am wrong" idea because I even said in my message "and I could be wrong". But all the other things she wrote was like reading something I would hear in a child's temper tantrum. None of it made sense, especially if you read my message(s). Guess I just don't get where all the hatred is coming from.

People should be allowed to share a difference of opinion here. Not one side does and the other doesn't. But in the future if she doesn't want to hear other people's experiences/opinions then she should write at the end of the message - No conservatives, independent, or anyone not in the democrat party is allowed to respond.

Enjoyed your post and your civil tone. - sm

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Often people believe something is either black or white, good or bad, etc, and I think this limits their thinking and ability to engage in constructive dialogue. Life would be so much easier if things really were black and white, but so much of life is a complicated composition of shades of grey. I have found that casting about for answers in the grey areas is overwhelming at times and I wish I could just pick a side, black or white, and cling to it until I can catch my breath, avoiding all of the questions, but in the end I know that is not where the answers lie (with rare exception) and so I have to go back to the grey areas to explore the issues and the people and make the best determination of a thing or a person that I can, on my own.

Anony2 was civil too - what if

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She explained her viewpoint in a rational and civil tone. She gave specific details.

Things are not black and what and that is what she was trying to explain. Sometimes things are not what they seem and if you just stick with black and white and you don't even read or listen to other things you'll be stuck always thinking your right and everyone is is wrong.

She explained why she liked and voted for Obama and why she feels differently about that now and why she doesn't listen to any of the news agencies and why she prefers to get her news elsewhere (probably from people she can trust that don't have a vested interest for or against).

I think people should be open to everything. Sometimes the correct answer is not what you think it is.

She also explained whey she thinks its wrong that if someone doesn't agree with something they said they should note be called names like conspiracy theorist, ignorant or stupid.

I think people need to be open to the consideration that they can be wrong about certain things. Not everything is black and white. There are colors that need to be considered. It is the ones who don't and won't listen that are the ignorant. Not the ones who prefer to go to a different source to get their information and then research it from there. I think that is what she was trying to say. But the reply she received was again talking about if you listen to certain news stations (which I believe she means Fox) that you are ignorant. It may have been civil, but it was bordering on calling others that don't agree with her or share her viewpoint ignorant.

I think everyone should be able to voice their opinions. If they hear things or read things they should be able to discuss it here in a rational and civil tone. It used to be like that a couple years ago. They should not be called nasty names because they don't agree with them. People should not say that certain news places are not credible but the ones they listen to are. That it's okay for one group to call people names but not another. The country is going through some really turbulent times right now. I think people need to band together and support each other, listen to different ideas and respectfully debate issues and they should not continue on the lies that one political group (the one they don't associate with) hates women or is going to have all old people starve and die and take away your right to vote or any other rights you have and just really "stupis" stuff like that. If you read up on how the civil war was started you can see we are repeating history and nobody wants another civil war. Well at least not the citizens.

My mother used to tell me disagree on issues but remain respectful of the other person because they are the same as you. They want the same things. Everyone wants to work and have decent health coverage, be able to save for their future and provide for their children. People really are no different in that respect.

Oh, wow... - KeeperOfArea51

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I have very dear friends with whom I discuss politics and we tease each other in a constructive/informative way about our differences. NONE of them have ever brought up this Socialism/Communism thing, and they would as we freely discuss these issues w/o ridicule. If you and I met in person, I would not be able to verbalize a response...Wow. I guess if I you new I was a stupid liberal you'd name me as the shooter on the grassy knoll, but sadly that happened before I was born. I just wish that the Repub candidates would address real issues, i.e., jobs (was cited somewhere as one of the Prez's weaknesses, but since he took ofc, independent statistics have shown the # of unemployed continues to go down compared to good ol' GDub's terms. It seems to me that the Pub candidates just want to boast that they fix the country, yet they have no suggestions to do so, only boasting that they would be the one to beat Obama.

You really shouldn't call yourself a stupid liberal - anony2

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We all have difference of opinion. No need to call others or yourself stupid. I think I even said that in my post. Nobody is stupid. We all have different ideas. As you wish the republican candidates would address real issues I wish the democrats would too. I have been reading about the issues they are discussing. Unemployment, the war, etc. Those are real issues. At least to me and others I know they are. I have not heard issues being discussed from the democrats except for name calling and avoid the issues. The hard proof that unemployment and foreclosures are on the rise. I wish they would address that and why it continues to get worse under democrat rule. I wish they would discuss how they will fix it, what steps are they taking to solve the problems, get people working once again, and help people from losing their homes. These are not issues they are discussing. Instead they are too busing calling anyone a republican/independent a name, blaming everything wrong they are doing on them, while not having any solutions or ideas.

I think the republicans are doing an okay job (not good enough though) at reminding people the failures that are happening. If there is any hope for our future and the citizens of the country we need to be out from under the democrats. All they are concerned about is getting richer, getting their 1%er friends rich and supporting wall street and CEOs to get richer. As for us little peons (to them). Those middle and low income people. They just don't care about us.

Wouldn't know about the grassy knoll thing. I was very young when that happened. JFK was one of the greatest presidents of our time and I just don't think its funny to joke about things like that.

As for you saying your just a stupid liberal, please don't beat yourself up like that. Nobody is stupid or ignorant (despite what the OP wrote) if they will open their minds and look at facts. We need to unite together instead of wanting to be divided.

I need to ask you one question....sm - oldtimer

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You said "It's just not what I believe and want for my family and friends and others in the country who are low income trying to survive, and not what the country is founded on." My question is who do you plan on voting for that you think will help the "low income trying to survive"? ...and, what do you consider to be "what our country was founded on" in regard to President Obama or anyone else? Your post is confusing to me.

Good question - my reply - anony2

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Right now I'm not sure who I will vote for or if I will even vote. I know the democrats have done nothing to help us and all the middle and low income families I know. Democrats generally talk the talk but don't walk the walk.

Unless someone can give me a good solid reason to vote for him again it will be a no go. I'm not wild about Romney. I believe he understands what the middle and low income are struggling with, although he is very wealthy, but then so are all the democrats. I don't think Obama really understand the struggles we face each day or if he does and this is how he treats us that is just very bad and he doesn't deserve any votes. Newt - no. I don't know what it is about him. I just don't think he'd be a good president. Sanitorum - No. I don't agree with his religious points of view and I think that would override his ability to make the right decisions. I don't know much about his experience, but there is just something about him I don't care for. I think he appears weak. I think being so bold with his religious ideations just lost it for me. Ron Paul - Yes and here is why. I've agreed with most all his votes he cast. He understands the economy. He understand jobs. He understands the constitution. People say his foreign policies are "scary", but they never say what that means. It's like a line they heard from MSNBC and they keep repeating it, but not ever saying what it means to them. I think he's earned respect of a lot of foreign leaders. Unfortunately he appears old and frail and therefore would never be elected. But for me he has the most electability. Dennis Kucinich -yes. I'd vote for him in a minute. I have always enjoyed listening to him and agree with a lot of his ideas. He is probably the most honest politician I've heard and followed. When he believes he's right he's not afraid to stand up for what he says no matter how much backlash he gets. He just explains his viewpoints very rationally and calmly. Obama - no. Biden - No. Clinton - NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO. Bachman - That would be a BIG NO. Mitch Daniels - Yes. Anyone with ties to Clinton - No. Anyone with ties to Gore - Not no but he!! no. Anyone who stands up for the people, knows how to fix the economy instead of whining three years later it's not their fault and they've only been in office "overnight". - yes. I particularly really don't care who fixes it. I just want it fixed. I have not seen that in the current administration because they are not interested in fixing things and getting people back to work. Okay, that's your first question.

Next, what our country was founded on... The Constitution. Little by little it's being torn apart. I don't think that needs any further explanation if people have been paying attention.

I hope I explained that better so it's not confusing.

I enjoyed reading your post. - sm

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I will be voting (again) for Obama because I truly believe he cares about ALL people in this nation. The Republicans have made it clear that they are only "in the tank" for the ultra rich.

I agree with you about Kucinich. Another one I could vote for would be Russ Feingold, but they're not running.

To me, it's the matter of a simple question: Do we want even more middle class people falling into poverty while the gap between the very rich and the very poor continues to widen? I truly believe that's what the Republicans really want to happen, based on the candidates' own statements, not some "liberal talking points." I'm on Social Security, so I certainly won't be voting for ANY Republican.

I've HEARD Mitt Romney say that foreclosures should continue so "investors" can purchase these properties and "put renters in." Result? American Dream down the drain for most middle-class people.

I've HEARD Santorum say he doesn't care how high unemployment is. It doesn't matter to him. Instead, he's worried about shoving his personal religious beliefs down EVERYONE'S throats. He believes that sex should occur ONLY within the confines of marriage and ONLY for the purpose of procreation. He wants to take us back to the "barefoot and pregnant" days, and I personally refuse to go there. I'm too old to need birth control now (plus I had a hysterectomy about a dozen years ago), but I want my granddaughter to be able to have all options open for her regarding her reproductive health (and that includes using the pill for MEDICAL reasons, as I once had to do).

Gingrich said from the very beginning that he will be the winner of the nomination -- no doubt in his mind. I'd prefer to vote for someone whose ego is the right size because I believe hubris is bad for this country. He also wants children to work at their schools in a janitorial role. When are they supposed to do homework? All that will do is create a new subsection of poor people earning minimum wage (or less). He wants to change child labor laws in favor of the EMPLOYER. I have two grandsons who are ALWAYS busy doing their homework when they come home from school. I shudder at the thought that that time might be taken away from them so that they may become serfs to the privileged in this country.

I personally am receiving Social Security disability (after working on the books for 40 YEARS) because I became very ill six years ago with an incurable disease, so I obviously don't want the United States using Paul Ryan's budget, which punishes the poor and rewards the ultra rich. While waiting for my hearing in this case, I lived on $200.00 per MONTH, plus $200.00 in food stamps, so I know a thing or two about being poor. (And before readers of this post try to call me lazy and unworthy to receive this $200.00 monthly stipend, please know that EVERY SINGLE PENNY was paid back when my Social Security finally came through.

I'm not so quick to blame Obama. He was able to get bin Laden, something Bush claimed he didn't care about any more. Obama did that, not a Republican. It was a Republican that created this bad economy, though.

The economy is beginning to turn around, and that's a very good sign. Obama did that, too. However, he inherited 8 years of a pure MESS that Republican Bush created. It's not surprising to think that if it took 8 years to create this mess, it may take a while to get rid of it. Bailing out the auto industry has proven to be a GOOD thing that Obama did, certainly better than the Republican plan.

Obama is trying to impose tax cuts on middle class people in this country. Of course, the Republicans oppose that and, instead, want more tax cuts for the ultra rich, thus widening the gap even further between the rich and the middle class/poor.

I do wish Obama would do other things. For example, I think the Republicans' buddies, the Wall Street crooks, should be investigated, charged, tried and receive the harshest penalty allowable under law. Those greedy bankers owe a LOT of money to the American people.

Instead, things like CONTRACEPTION are being discussed, and Santorum doesn't want YOU to make your own family planning choices. Instead, he wants to place the nation under the Pope's rule.

It's an inherent belief I have that Obama is the ONLY one who actually cares about ALL Americans, even the poor ones. Despite all the hateful talk the Republicans spew about Obama, they do more damage to themselves when they show they only care about rich people.

From where I sit, to me, it's a shoe-in that Obama should win. However, when I look around, I'm seeing Republicans who are only willing to represent ONE faction of the citizenry here in America.

I'm getting flashbacks of "Men in Black," for sure, when I listen to Republicans, and it wouldn't be hard to believe that enemy aliens have landed and invaded the bodies of Republican politicians. LOL!

...and I thoroughly enjoyed your post. Good job! nm - VTMT

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Thank you for your reply - I enjoyed yours too - anony2 - message inside

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I loved your post. It's very respectful. It is possible to be on different sides and have civil conversations. That's where I learn a lot of what I know, from people on the opposite side of me giving me their input.

After thinking more on the subject I want to address a few of your points.

Good question - do we want more middle class falling into poverty, etc. No, that is something I feel strongly for. We cannot go backwards. And that is why I feel strongly that I will not be voting democrat this time. Please don't ask me to site a specific article or bill or link or anything. All I know is from everything I read, from everything I see happening across the country, the democrats are the ones pushing the middle income into poverty. That is my opinion.

Kucinich - again can't put my finger on why I like him. I've heard people say he's more left than Obama. Which is weird as to why I would like him, but I do. And my DH who is more conseravative than I am who cannot stand the socialist issues going on with the current crowd also really likes Kucinich (and he does more research than I do).

I've also heard the same about foreclosures with this crowd. The current administration is doing nothing to help people from foreclosures. My sister and her husband thought they would benefit, but nothing. I know other people who are losing their homes too and this administration is doing nothing to help. Foreclosure are on the rise and the gvt doesn't care because they are turning them around as rentals. Romney may have said what he did, but this admin is actually doing it, so I don't see a difference. I truly believe the American Dream went down the tubes a long time ago. When people started losing their jobs and homes their dreams all faded.

Agree with you on Santorum. I heard one of his relatives say he loves him because he's family, but is one of the most crooked politicians. I just really wish they would keep their religion to themselves. I don't care about their religion and all the weird beliefs they have. Just run the country. Oh wait, they don't run the country, they follow the orders :-)

Didn't know that about Gingrich. Didn't really care for the guy and I always knew he would never be nominated (lets face it, most presidents are good looking and that's another reason why people vote a certain way, because someone his handsome). Don't flame me, just an observation I saw in CA when Clinton was in.

I don't receive SS, so I don't have the same worries you do, to an extent. I don't know what is going to be there for me. I believe (don't know why and I could be wrong) but I believe they are draining SSN and not just this admin, this goes all the way back to before Bush Sr. Again could be wrong but that's what I think. Either way I'm sure I will be typing until the day I keel over my keyboard. I hear SS is broke, just hope it gets fixed and again I don't care who fixes it. It just needs to be fixed.

I have mixed feelings about the OBL thing. I've heard and read things that conflict with what is being told, and I'm sure you probably don't want to know what I really think. I never blamed or praised him for that. I also have mixed feelings about Bush. just thought the look on his face was an odd one when they told him about the attack on the towers. So that with a lot of evidence I read about, well like I say nobody really cares or wants to know my feeling about all of that, and I don't want to go into detail.

The bad economy was created a long time ago. I blame Clinton for signing NAFTA. For starting such an exodus of companies taking business overseas. The economy going down happened long before Bush.

I on the other hand do not think the economy is turning around. Every day in the news the news gets worse. More companies are laying off hundreds/thousands of people. Taking the jobs overseas. More people are out of work now and that continues to rise. Foreclosures on the rise. Cost of gas on the rise, cost of food on the rise, no pay increases to help cover that. More families moving in with other family members because they are out of work. The rich in wall street are getting even richer under Obama's watch. He's bailing out his banker buddies and CEOs while the country is suffering. I see no signs of improvement as does my DH. I keep asking him is there any hope. Is there anywhere in the country from his research that is improving and he says no. Things are getting worse. Fathers killing their children because they've lost everything. More crime, more homeless.

All I see is the stuff you say Obama is trying to do, I just don't believe that. From everything I read he says he wants to do it, but is not doing anything and it has nothing to do with the republicans. If he could pass the spendulous and bribe the politicians to vote for it then the other issues would be worked out too. Republicans are only trying to stop the complete destruction. I've read what they oppose him on. What I see is they are opposing the policies/bills, etc that would lead to a total melt down.

Anyway...it's late and that's all I can write and those are my opinion.

If it quacks like a duck - sm

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Calling a bogus reference, bogus, is the right thing to do.

From what I see, it is the Republicans who are always trying to amend the constitution to support their social agenda.

Very well thought out and respectful post (nm) - Zville MT

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^

Just curious - mbmt

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"When I read the background of all his czars and find out some are devoted communists and the speeches they are giving are trying to convince the audience that we need a communistic country, etc.,(quoted from your post).

Specifically, who exactly are you talking about when you say some are devoted communists?

I would like to know that too. nm - VMTT

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/

Reply - anony2

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You mean to say you really don't know? Here I'll tell you what. Do a Google search on Obama's communist Czars and you'll find plenty on the backgrounds of these people. Plenty of information out there if you want to find out.

P.S. - Google is not a conservative site.

Not interested in far right-wing websites - mbmt

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I did indeed try searching and if you think WND, commieblaster.com, liberty news, or red nation are credible sites with truthful information, I guess so be it. I think these websites are full of far right-wing rantings and that's about it.

Then you didn't research enough. The info is there - anony2

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And I don't know about those websites. I don't read them.

You are not interested so I am no longer going to have further conversations. This conversation is done. On my end at least go ahead and flame away and get the buddies to bully and gang up. I see thats the MO here. I have better things to do with my time than waste it on people who are not interesting in the truth. It like talking to a brick wall.

I you have a credible website(s) for your info...sm - oldtimer

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Why not share a link? Every other forum I participate in the posters freely share info they have learned via a link to a website, and it used to be the case here too. If you have something important to share give us a supporting link instead of telling people to search themselves. Thank you.

Curious enough to - actually research it?

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Pull up a list of Obama cabinet members. Make a copy of the list. Go to a search engine of your choice. Enter each name and start researching the backgrounds of each one of them as far back as you can take it, what associations, groups, civil meetings they attended, their political affiliations, political aspirations. Obama himself has attended Communist conferences, rallies, anti-Semite rallies/functions and traveled personally with Louis Farrakhan (no lover of freedom is Louis). Read their bios and speeches they made using their own words. Review videos of their speeches. If you are truly "curious" you will take the time needed to find out what all these people are about and what they believe and want to do America. Don't forget to throw George Soros in the mix, as he has provided an obscene amount of funding to the causes they believe in and they organizations they belong to, starting most of those organizations with his personal funds.

Several of us on this board have already done extensive research on Obama's cabinet and know whereof we speak...the rest on this board, not so much.

Cabinet members - mbmt

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Let's stick to the point. Who are these communist cabinet members? And, no I don't want to read the garbage on the far right-wing websites.

Then research the independent sites - sm

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All you have to do is some google searches. Yes I could put a ton of links down. I could even put in their biographies from their own sites or Huff Post, but you don't want to believe it so will write if off as right wing.

Do your own research. We are here discussion our concerns. Stop treating those that don't agree with you as though they are all stupid.

We research we read, we reference, we cross reference, and we cross reference the cross references. Married to an investigator I have learned how to research and analyze. Just because you don't want to believe it doesn't mean it's not true.

There are plenty of independent websites that talk about the czars, cabinet members, etc and describe their backgrounds. I'm not going to list them just so you can try and discredit all of them without even reading them.

Fact check is a pretty good website for the - truth too. nm

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.

It is your obligation to back up your claims....sm - VTMT

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on a public forum not instruct others to search for validation of your claims.

No one has an obligation to do anything - on this board other than be polite

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And most cannot post a civil word. If someone is too lazy to look up links, bios, history on their own, let them stew in their own ignorance of facts. Unless someone is paying me to do their research, they can do their own. I am smart enough, motivated enough, wise enough to find my way through all kinds of internet sites to research every person I want to. If someone else is too lazy to look something up, oh well...then it's their problem. I already help carry 50% of the population that pay no federal taxes by my sweat equity...I am not going to do research, too, for those too lazy to do it themselves.

Nice. - nm

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.

Nice. - nm - Put on your big girl pants, wipe your nose

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OP was right. No one owes anything to another on this board other than courtesy. If you cannot handle that, why are you on this board? Everyone is supposed to be an adult, responsible for their own behavior, posts, research. Easy concept to follow. :)

Response - anony2

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Why should anyone put up any links because those links are already slotted to be told they are not valid or credible.

We are not asking posters to search for validation of our claims. We are making a statement of our opinion or fact. Sometimes we put a link, sometimes not.

Say for instance someone says one of Obama's czars is a communist. If I'm sitting here saying, no that's not possible I don't believe it, it is my job to pull up Google or Bing or whatever search engine and start research for myself. It's my job to reference, cross reference and then cross reference the cross reference. Then with that information I can analyze it for myself and decide whether or not I want to believe it.

Sometimes there is no link to information people post, sometimes there is. So we put a link up, you come back with. It's not credible. Then we come back with another link and you once again say it's not credible and this goes on for 10 or so times until.

As an investigator you need to look at all leads. If someone tells you Hillary had a drug problem (which she doesn't of course, that is just an example). The investigator then says to the person, how do you know this and they say some thing that makes the investigator wonder whether or not its true. The investigator doesn't keep telling that person prove it, prove it again, prove it again, etc. No, the investigator then does extensive research and interviews of several different people and jobs, etc to find the truth. This is no different.

So it is a readers responsibility to find out for themselves whether or they believe information. If you read several different sites and you find out its not true then you just sit back and say oh that anony2, she's just blowing smoke and then you move on to better things. Or if you find it to be true, then you have to say...you know I thought that wasn't true but after all the research I've done I might possibly be wrong.

Nothing wrong with being wrong. I've had to admit hundreds of times I was wrong - and out loud too :-)

Its the wild goose chase ploy. - No Google search

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can tell us what the OP is talking about since the OP is not willing to say what s/he is talking about. If s/he doesn't know, nobody else can know. The wild goose chase ploy is akin to a coy and cryptic version of the smoke and mirrors game. There is no answer since there is no there there. It's all part of the Big Bad Boogeyman Commie myth and master plan the right is using to substitute for a bona fide party platform that addresses issues of national interest. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

No wild goose chase - if you can operate a computer

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I had absolutely no trouble researching Obama's cabinet members and found multitudes of information. Pretty sad people are so lazy and want everyone else to do their homework. But, heh you keep ignoring the man behind the curtain...it will not serve you well. Find it very telling that several on here have had no trouble whatsoever locating all kinds of videos, speeches and information substantiating Obama's "commie ties". Just goes to show you the ignorance the left is "using to substitute for a bona fide party platform that addresses issues of national interest", and the left's desire to hide their commie ties with "smoke and mirrors". Pretty pathetic some have not mastered the ability to use a search engine, and expect other with motivation and intelligence to do the lazy's work for them, too. Hmmm...sounds like communist/socialist behavior.

I agree. - Its pretty sad

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when folks make bogus claims they are too lazy to back up by explaining what the devil they think they are talking about. Apparently they are not willing to put their own claims up for public scrutiny or engage in a two-sided discussion on the junk THEY post....which goes to show us all just how weak the claims are in the first place. The commie/socialist schtick is a failed dead end strategy. All the personal insults you can muster do not change the basic fact that all these distractions and side shows serve no useful purpose other than to expose the plenty of nothing the right wing of the GOP has to offer, not to mention their my-way-or-the-highway orientation.

I agree. - Its pretty sad - Who wipes your nose for you?

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Probably too lazy to do that for yourself either. Not one single poster on this entire board owes you anything, including explanations for whatever they post. As many before me said, if someone is too lazy to do their own searching, then you are too immature to be part of a grown-up conversation about something as serious as politics. When OPs post links, you guys line up like a firing squad to try and see who can be more insulting; just look at your posts. Sad so many spend hours on being rude and can't use 15 minutes to enter info into the search bar.

"All the personal insults you can muster do not change the basic fact that all these distractions and side shows serve no useful purpose other than to expose the plenty of nothing the left wing of theDmes/libs have to offer, not to mention their my-way-or-the-highway orientation." Yep---you described yourself perfectly.

They are not interested in finding the information - anony2

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They would rather you do all the work just so when you do post the information they can tell you it's a bogus website, no credible, not legible, not that, not this, blah, blah, blah. I'm sure they already have the responses written down waiting to ridicule anyone who doesn't believe what they do, which is exactly nothing. There is nothing they believe in because they're to busy bashing, trashing, and hating.

All I was saying was for people to do some research, but guess that's too hard for them.

Hey, anony2 - mbmt

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I think you were the one that said there are cabinet members who are communists. Some of us just want to know who you are referring to, and , of course, we know that no reputable website is going to say such a thing about President Obama or his cabinet members. Why? Because labeling some Americans as socialists and communists is the popular thing to do for far right-wing thinkers, not necessarily all conservatives, and certainly reputable news sites are not participating in this sort of smearing.

Do you hear yourself? - nm

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ANony2 - Nothing hard about researching - Conservative

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So what's the big problem? If someone is truly intersted in a subject, where is the problem with looking it up on your own just to be better schooled in the subject? There is really something wrong with thinking you are "owed" an explanation by any poster. It just seems odd that there are posters on here all day every day, insulting posters at every opportunity. It seems time would be so much better spent if they actually bothered to do their own research.

As an MT, if you indeed are one...sm - VTMT

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you should know that anything found on a search engine is not to be taken as fact without considering the source and verifying.

VTMT - If YOU have any desire for truth

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"you should know anything found on a search engine" can be researched until you have all the facts, source materials, books, videos, speeches, archived materials you want. Takes work, but I guess the entitlement society is too lazy to do that to...Not hard to verify information either, but again, someone has to have a desire for the truth.

Some media like to make the news instead of report it. - nm

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x

My thoughts - Anyone who posts - something they claim

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to be fact should provide one to two links to back of their claims, in the way one would a research paper, and let the readers decide whether the sources are credible or not. Afterall, the poster got the information from SOMEWHERE, right? I really don't have much respect for anyone who posts opinion as fact and then says, "And, NO, I'm not going to provide a link for you because you're too lazy to do the research" or "I'm not including the links because you will just say the source isn't credible." That tells me the OP citing something as fact really doesn't have a credible leg to stand on. If it's your opinion, why not just say so? If you believe it to be a fact, why not include a link to that info?

I also thought this board was beginning to have more civilized discussion, but I was wrong. Maybe most of the posters have been ensconced in the solitude of their home offices for so long that they forget how to be civil.

Please don't go. Some of us appreciate your - civil opinion. nm

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.

LOL! I keep promising myself I won't come - back to this site but

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I find myself drawn to it in the same way a rubbernecker is drawn to a car accident.

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