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I want to know who this administration is (sm)

Posted: Apr 27, 2013

trying to protect. First, they interrupt questioning to mirandize the bomber when they had 48 hours before they had to. They were collecting information, and under the direction of the DOJ were stopped by a magistrate. Now this. It leads me to believe they are protecting Islamic extremists - Muslim Brotherhood - unless someone has a better explanation. See link.

;

I have one observation/question... - Independent-repubican sm

[ In Reply To ..]
When you say mirandize, do you mean reading him his Miranda rights? If so, do you think he should not have been given Miranda rights? I don't have cable so not catching a lot of this, and I may be wrong, but I thought he was a US citizen. Again, I could be wrong, but if he is a US citizen shouldn't he be given Miranda rights? After all if they don't give him his Miranda rights then what if someone framed you or anyone else here, are you and everyone else not deserving of Miranda rights.

If that's not what you are talking about then just forget my whole message LOL, but just an observation I have from what I have read on the internet and hearing some senators say he should be tortured and not given Miranda rights, are they now picking and choosing what laws they want to apply to anyone. Then I think that could be any one of us. Not saying they set him up at all (if that's what posters think I'm saying), but what I am saying is that possibility is out there because it has happened in the past. I would think that every one of us would want the laws applied to everyone equally, especially if they truly are innocent.

I don't know all the details of this, but all I know is if he is a US citizen he should be afforded the same rights as everyone else no matter what he did (or didn't do).

As for the part about the Muslim brotherhood I cannot comment on that because to be honest I don't know much about the group or anything about it. Just haven't had time to read up about it, just hearing it mentioned here and there, so my comments about it would be based on nothing. I'm just curious about the Miranda rights part.

Answer to your question - (sm) - Abby

[ In Reply To ..]
Thanks to the "Public Safety Exception" to Miranda (which was created in 1980), the government is not forced to choose between treating a suspect as an enemy combatant or immediately allowing said suspect to hide behind an attorney and the right to remain silent. In extraordinary circumstances, when a suspect is believed to be part of a broader conspiracy that might result in the loss of innocent life, authorities have 48 hours to question the suspect before mirandizing him.

They were in the process of gathering information (NYC plot, for example). They should not have been interrupted. Yes, he would have to be "mirandized" but not like it was done. That was very suspicious. FBI claims they didn't know this was going to happen. So why did it?

You do realize evidence compiled - before reading of Miranda sight

[ In Reply To ..]
for US citizens is inadmissible during trial, right? My guess is the defendant was revealing information the DOJ considered crucial to the case and, therefore, rightly wanted to insure it would be admissible, especially if additional conspiracy charges (the NYC plot) are pending.

That's what I think. Also for public safety in case there - was another explosive

[ In Reply To ..]
dropped somewhere or if there was another terror teammate that was picking up where the brothers left off.

Yes, but it didn't matter. They had enough plus - his confession.

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

Confessions before Miranda are not admissible. - 5th and 6th Amendment violations

[ In Reply To ..]
There's just no getting around the fact that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is a naturalized citizen who is entitled to his Constitutional rights and due process. Despite the heinous nature of his crimes, that will not change, nor will the terms of Miranda. No information extracted before suspects have been advised of their rights is viable. That includes confessions.

I suspect the DOJ is intensely interested in prosecuting to the FULLEST extent possible under the law. This means being sure all charges brought against him are thoroughly supported with as much evidence as they can get, and that all Is are dotted and all Ts are crossed in terms of the investigative process, his incarceration and trial procedures. Most of us who rely on media reporting for our information have no clue as to what is going on behind the scenes, how much more there is that has not yet been reported, nor the the chronology of what they knew and when they knew it.

They had eyewitnesses. You can argue with me (sm) - Abby

[ In Reply To ..]
all you like and it doesn't change the fact that Eric Holder's DOJ interfered and I say they are trying to protect the Muslim Brotherhood, or some other criminals - IOW, people like themselves.

Why would they do that? - nm

[ In Reply To ..]
x

Good question - ask Eric why he changes laws. - Who knows?

[ In Reply To ..]
nm

No, I'm asking you. You said it. Please - explain nm

[ In Reply To ..]
x

Why don't you go back to my original post and see - if you can figure it out.

[ In Reply To ..]
I'm not spoonfeeding anyone. I said what I meant.

you didn't say what motivation you believe they have to protect the Muslim - Brotherhood

[ In Reply To ..]
or other criminals. You made the statement. I'm just asking why they would do it. You don't have to answer, but quite a severe charge to have no explanation.

I want very badly to say How the H should I know (sm) - me

[ In Reply To ..]
but if I do, I'll probably get banned. All I can say for sure is this DOJ takes great pains not to punish Muslims or blacks. The why part is a good question and troubling to many Americans.

You are wrong. Why you think they do is very - troubling. nm

[ In Reply To ..]
x

Brace yourself. I'm afraid - I have some bad news.

[ In Reply To ..]
The Muslim Brotherhood is not, I repeat, not on the US State Department's list of foreign terrorist organizations. Ideologically, they are a far right, conservative religious political party, the Middle East's equivalent to the US Christian Right. Their party is represented in varying numbers across the Middle East and Northern African Muslim countries. President Morsi of Egypt is MB and the Egyptians gave them a clear plurality in their 2011 election, capturing around 37% of all seats. Their nearest contender was the Nour Party with 24%. They did not fare as well in neighboring Libya.

Their local chapters across the region exhibit cultural differences when contrasting one country with another. For example, compared to Egypt's MB party, in Yemen they are more accurately described as a cross-ideological inter-party coalition.

You may be confusing them with the Palestinian Hamas, an offshoot of Egypt's MB, who is on the US State Department's list. Their relations with other MB countries has deteriorated recently, ie, they are none too keen on Egypt's decision to uphold their peace treaty with Israel. Hamas are dedicated to the cause of Palestinian liberation and the end to Israel's occupation. As such, the US role in that occupation has put it in the US cross-hairs and vice versa.

MB needs no "protection" from the US or any of it's executive branch leaders. It is perfectly capable of taking care of its own self. Next time you go casting aspersions and making such wild accusations, at least please try to identify the correct target. This kind of reminds me of when the Reddit crowd-sourcing vigilantes fingered Sunil Tripathi as one of the Boston bombers, only to find out they were blaming a dead guy, found last week floating around in the Providence River.

Only bad news you have is y our inability to - conduct adeque research on MB

[ In Reply To ..]
and what they are all about....just another bike rack poster here.

So please expound - please

[ In Reply To ..]
.

The DOJ has taken it upon himself to make new laws for this country - Truthhurts

[ In Reply To ..]
and trample the laws in place. The FBI should have stepped in and arrested the federal magistrate and DOJ attorney for obstruction of justice (would have loved to see that! LOL).

The FBI were using the public safety clause, which clearly stated by the Supreme Court: "The public safety exception is triggered when police officers have an objectively reasonable need to protect the police or the public from immediate danger. Because the standard is objective, the availability of the exception does not depend on subjective motivation of the officers. Legitimate concerns for officer safety or public safety prompting unwarned custodial questioning arise in a variety of contexts. A common factor that can be gleaned from the courts addressing this issue is the prior knowledge or awareness of specific facts or circumstances that give rise to the imminent safety concern that prompted the questioning."

Evidently, Holder's DOJ decided there was no danger to people unless others were blown up later (which would have happened had not Canada arrested those two terrorists).

http://www.examiner.com/article/obama-s-justice-department-torpedoes-boston-bomber-interrogation

Obama will never "fire" Holder because he does everything he can to protect Obama and those who feel they can rule this country the way they see fit and not by the laws of this country.

On another subject (to show how nuts California is) is this:

The California State Assembly voted Thursday to amend its juror law, which currently applies only to to U.S. citizens, to include “lawfully present immigrants.” The legislation is now headed to the state Senate for another vote.

I can only guess the reason....more votes for the Democrats.

Let's try this one more time minus the opinions - and cheap-shots

[ In Reply To ..]

After reading the linked even-handed article below, my understanding is that the court is required to mirandize defendants when they first appear before a judge. Federal rules also require defendants to have initial hearings “without unnecessary delay”—usually defined as within one business day. It would appear that Michael Rogers R-MI believes that when a judge acts in accordance with her sworn duty to uphold 5th and 6th Amendment Constitutional provisions, she is somehow "interfering" with the investigation. Some would agree, others would not (myself included).

After the first charges were filed in her court, Judge Bowler informed DOJ on Saturday of her intent to hold the hearing the following Monday at the hospital where she formally read Tsarnaev his rights and the charges against him. She cites intense television coverage of his capture as one reason she had decided to start criminal prosecution proceedings.

Andrew Arena, head of the Detroit office of the Federal Bureau of Investigation during the "underwear bomber'' investigation in 2009, said he thought the Boston case was handled properly: "When you bring the judge into it, that's what's going to happen. They don't work for the Justice Department, they don't work for Capitol Hill, they are going to do what they are legally obligated to do,'' said Mr. Arena. "I think [investigators] got what they were going to get out of him, anyway.''

Though “not happy about it,” the FBI was aware of the planned hospital-room hearing on Monday, but declined further comment. The House Intelligence Committee asked them why they had not raised objections, they said it was not their role to interfere with the judge’s decision to initiate proceedings. Statements made by Mr. Arena and the FBI makes sense since they align with the explicit Constitutional political doctrines of separation of powers, the FBI being part of the executive, not judicial, branch of government.

TH, there's really nothing new about these laws, principles or procedures. In fact, they are America's bedrock framework. There is also nothing new about partisans pols turning a blind eye to them and trying to confuse the issue with unnecessary hyperbolic rhetoric and misguided finger-pointing.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323789704578444940173125374.html

Too bad you had to end your little article with cheap shots - and opinion. (not TH)

[ In Reply To ..]
opposing viewpoints - that's all it is.

I'm not the awesome poster to whom you addressed , but - what cheap shot?

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x

I combed the post but failed to find any - (sm)

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in either the article or what the OP wrote about it.

....Judge informed the DOJ on Saturday? Why didn't she inform the FBI? - Truthhurts

[ In Reply To ..]
They were in charge, not the DOJ....because they and the FBI have been at odds for quite a while. This was all political to not inform the FBI.

From that article:
The judge's move, made on Monday in the hospital where Mr. Tsarnaev was recovering, has prompted some Republican lawmakers to press the Justice Department as to why it didn't make a stronger bid to resist the judge's plans.

Those lawmakers say Mr. Tsarnaev's interrogation should have continued without him being advised of his right to remain silent, because they say agents should have had more time to determine if there were other undetected bombs or plotters. After being read his rights, the suspect stopped talking to investigators, officials said.

"There will be more instances like this, and we will need to have a much better understanding about what is appropriate," House Intelligence Committee Chairman Mike Rogers (R., Mich.) said in an interview Thursday. "We have a long-standing tradition that the judiciary does not interfere with investigations. This sets a very dangerous precedent."

Also in the article is the reason for not mirandizing him from the start: nder a 1984 Supreme Court ruling, a public-safety exception allows investigators to question suspects for an unspecified period without giving them a Miranda warning. The exception is designed to give law-enforcement officials time to determine if there are other threats to public safety.

IOW, the FBI wanted more time for interrogation to make sure there were no other threats or danger to the public somewhere, but this Judge took it upon herself to thwart the investigation.

Sorry, but I still hold to the opinion that the Judge was WRONG, the DOJ was WRONG not to either inform the FBI or to tell the Judge to wait a little longer.

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