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Trickle Down - Version 2.0
Posted: Apr 14, 2011
As I have tired to explain before, one of the consequences of \"union busting\" is that wage and benefit slashing will happen at all levels of employment. Here is an example of the \"whittling\" away of wages in the private sector. Big tax breaks but no living wage. The wage might seem adequate to you, but you need to remember that these jobs are in a city where rent is probably $1,000 per month, with higher car insurance, heating and general cost of living.
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Wish we had MT unions, They hold the wages up for everyone to a livable amount - Concerned
[ In Reply To ..]If unions are beaten down, the wages for everyone in the middle class will go down with them.
I totally agree with you - mbmt
[ In Reply To ..]Unions have definite pluses. One of those pluses is that they push for wages people can live on. When a group of union workers is defeated, it is not long before the private sector workers feel the pain also and that being that wages go down for private sector workers also.
No, you have it completely backwards. The - private sector workers
[ In Reply To ..]feel the pain of those raised wages when the products and services they have to use go UP to pay for that wage increase.
FedEx has managed not to unionize their workers, they are certainly competitive with the union UPS, and it is cheaper to use FedEx. So your theory is blown.
Disagree with you. I've seen with my own eyes that unions keep up the wages of non-union worker - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
AND they keep the prices of goods and - services ever rising to
[ In Reply To ..]pay for those wage hikes. You KNOW that, you just won't admit it because it does not support your case. Don't have to see it with my own eyes. I feel it in my pocketbook every time a union strikes somewhere for higher wages. That is trickle down all right. They get a raise, I have to pay more for something.
Please. Don't act like we cannot figure out that "little" drawback to unions.
That's a lie started by big business that doesn't want to pay decent wages - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
No. Its a fact you deny.... so you call it a "lie". nm - Frank
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Private sector workers..clearing it up - mbmt
[ In Reply To ..]That should be non-union workers instead of private sector workers as there are private sector unions also...just clearing that up. That being said, I still think unions help all workers in the long run.
Unions nowadays hold employees prisoner. nm - NoThanks
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Baloney - mbmt
[ In Reply To ..]nm
That is wrong on so many levels I cannot even - begin...lol nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Thank you for your valuable input. - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
About as valuable as the post I replied to... - which was the point. nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
If unions strong arm companies into raising - wages, to stay open
[ In Reply To ..]the business (or corporation) has to raise the price of the goods or services the private sector have to use, so even if you are getting a raise you are going to see higher prices yourself. So maybe you the union worker breaks even, but the rest of us in the private sector are screwed. Thank you SO much. Higher costs of cars, plumbers who charge 40-50-60 dollars an hour, need I go on?
THAT is what unions DO. They cause the other 3/4 of us to pay higher prices for everything.
Not a good tradeoff from where I sit.
Unions do not "Strong Arm" - sm
[ In Reply To ..]companies. It is called NEGOTIATION. Perhaps all you nonunion workers just do not have skills worth paying more for.
The plumber, electrician, airline pilot, and others who are unionized have skills commensurate with what their employee and UNION have negotiated.
Maybe you should try flying that jet yourself, or repairing the plumbing or wiring in your house.
They make more because they are highly skilled. Try getting a better paying job if you have a problem with that. We don't all need to come down to your pay level.
Nice insulting post... and needless to say, inaccurate.nm - Kim
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Oh, so a nonunion plumber is not as skilled - as a union plumber....
[ In Reply To ..]Your arrogance is astounding. And yes, unions DO strongarm...remember the SEIU purple shirts kicking the crap out of a guy on video? They used to come to "negotiations" with fence posts in their hands. And their attempts to unionize places involve intimidation....not the rank and file but the organizers. You are the epitome of the union organizer of today.
Try digging real deep and see if you find any humanity left inside yourself....it might help your case.
Union workers do have proper training. Don't know about the others - I prefer union workers personally
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Yeah, I bet you do. wink wink LOL - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
What's with the wink wink!? Doing a Sarah Palin imitation? - When words fail, wink!
[ In Reply To ..]Just teasing. I know you aren't doing that.
Taking a break to go back to that topic though, the wink thing didn't wear well for Sarah Palin. I don't know if she thought it was cute or what, but I don't think it is an effective means of communication.
Predictable, predictable, predictable....and - you wonder why you
[ In Reply To ..]got shellacked in the midterms.
But please...continue. wink wink
Question for you - mbmt
[ In Reply To ..]Why do you think there are so many minimum wage jobs with no benefits now?
Maybe because.... - see inside.
[ In Reply To ..]Imagine a Unionized McDonalds
You pull into McDonald's at lunch time. Since the parking lot is nearly empty you decide to go inside, rather than using the drive-thru. You contemplate ordering single items off the $5 menu, but instead decide to go with a Big Mac Extra Value Meal that includes the sandwich, fries and drink, for only $19.95.
Up at the counter the cashier, Cheryl, takes your order. She makes 17.95/hour plus benefits. Cheryl informs you that you are going to have to wait about 15 minutes. Apparently there aren't any fries in the bin, and a new batch has to be made.
You: Why does it take 15 minutes to make more fries? Isn't this supposed to be fast food?
Cheryl: Our fry guy, Bob, just went on break. Don't worry, he'll get right on it as soon as he gets back.
You: I see like six people back there. Why can't one of them drop a new batch of fries?
Cheryl: Because making fries isn't their job. That's Bob's job.
You: Uh, ok. Since I have some time to kill, can I ask you a couple of questions?
Cheryl: Sure.
You: How does this place stay in business? The prices seem really high for what I'm getting. It's fast food that isn't fast, and it's lunch time with hardly any one here. How do you manage it?
Cheryl: Don't you pay attention to the news? We just got a $60 billion bailout from the government. Don't worry, our jobs are safe here.
You: Thanks for the explanation.
lol
So true, yet union members seem "brainwashed" to - believe otherwise, unfortunately.nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Union members are brainwashed - sm
[ In Reply To ..]Now, that makes sense. Yes, union members are brainwashed! The actually think they deserve a family wage that fairly compensates their skill level, decent benefits and working conditions.
Tell me, when did your neighbors who are firefighters, teachers, nurses, and the few other employees who are lucky enough to still have union representation become your enemy.
All this anti union rhetoric sounds like misplaced anger and jealousy.
As for the comment above that unions wages cause prices to rise and hurt your "pocketbook" tell me when the last time any union went out on strike in the last year or more, and how that made the price of gas go up or groceries prices skyrocket, since most of the employees working in those industries are NOT unionized?
The logic here is seriously twisted, barely even worth responding to. Just good for a laugh.
No, I used to be in a union, and was "taught" many - TL
[ In Reply To ..]things, including who to vote for! This should be criminal. Unions have become too big, too influential, too abusive. They were formed to protect workers, but now they just tie the hands of everyone. I will never belong to another one.. ever.
Oil companies do not have unions? - Backwards Typist
[ In Reply To ..]I'm sure they do. Also, I'm sure those who work in the food industry (the production plants) are unionized. Teamsters cover the trucking industry who deliver the groceries. You don't believe any of these union-operated companies make our prices skyrocket?
When was the last time any union went on strike was one of your questions and your answer is this year, last year, the year before, almost every year....mostly teachers and in more than one school district. Nurses also go on strike a lot. Temple Hospital (PA) nurses just went on strike a couple months ago. Whether they are still on strike or not, I wouldn't know.
Nurses in my area are threatening to go on strike again. They usually go on strike every time the contract is up for re-negotiation.
Open your eyes. I could probably mention a lot more union-operated businesses but your post really shows me that you have no idea of what goes on in the real world.
You are right, backwards....the Union covering - the food industry is
[ In Reply To ..]UFCW...United Food and Commercial Workers. This from their website:
If you live in Hawaii, Florida, Fairbanks, AK, Prince Edward Island, or virtually any point in between, it is likely that you will buy food in a retail food store where we work.
Altogether we are more than 1 million working men and women throughout North America. We work for the largest companies in the industry and for many smaller independent companies in cities and towns both large and small.
We work in the familiar occupations of stocker, checker, cashier, meat cutter and produce clerk. We also work behind the scenes on computer systems that adjust product prices and inventory management processes.
Key Employers*
A&P
Food Basics
Super Fresh
Kohl's
Waldbaum's
Ahold USA
Brunos
Shop & Stop
Tops
Giant Food of Landover (Washington/Baltimore area)
Albertson's
Acme
Jewel
Lucky
George Weston Ltd
Loblaw
Real Canadian Superstore
Zehrs Markets
Kroger
King Soopers
Fred Meyer
Ralphs
Smiths
QFC
Fry's
Safeway
Vons
Dominick's
Carrs
Canada Safeway
Other
Meijer
Pathmark
Shaw's
Schnucks
Stater Brothers Markets
*This list is just a sample of the supermarkets where UFCW members work.
Looks to me like they are ALL over making our food prices that much HIGHER. Then along come Teamsters to add to that because they deliver most of it. NOt really hard to see that the people who are supposed to be FOR the worker are actually the boots on the neck of the consumers of America.
And here are the other major unions.... - looks like they are in
[ In Reply To ..]where prices to the consumer are directly affected...
Communications Workers of America
The Communications Workers of America is the largest labor union that represents workers within the field of telecommunications. Workers in broadcasting, publishing and journalism are among the many careers represented by the union. As of 2010, the union counts more than 700,000 workers as part of its family, including more than 500,000 who work in web-based careers.
Communications Workers of America
501 3rd St. NW
Washington, DC 20001
202-434-1100
cwa-union.org
AFL-CIO
The AFL-CIO is a federation of 56 labor unions across the globe. Its unions represent teachers, firefighters, bakers and pilots, just to name a few. More than 11 million workers are protected by the AFL-CIO, as of 2010.
AFL-CIO
815 16th St. N.W.
Washington, DC 20006
202-637-5000
aflcio.org
American Federation of State, County & Municipal Employees
The American Federation of State, County & Municipal Employees (AFSCME) takes care of more than 1 million workers involved in various vital service careers such as sanitation workers, nurses, correction officers and emergency medical technicians.
American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees
1625 L St. N.W.
Washington, DC 20036
202-429-1000
afscme.org
International Association of Machinists & Aerospace Workers
This large labor union represents a variety of industrial careers. More than 700,000 million members, as of 2010, have careers in woodworking and the aerospace, automotive and transportation industries.
The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers
9000 Machinists Place
Upper Marlboro, MD 20772
301-967-4500
goiam.org
International Brotherhood of Teamsters
The Teamsters has more than 1 million current members and also counts more than 500,000 retired members. The union represents more than 21 industrial careers and includes workers in the film industry, dairy workers, delivery workers of UPS and DHL, freight railroad workers and printers.
International Brotherhood of Teamsters
25 Louisiana Ave. N.W.
Washington, DC 20001
202-624-6800
teamster.org
Service Employees International Union (SEIU)
This large union of service employees counts more than 2 million members as part of its family. The union represents a variety of service careers including building security personnel, nurses, lab technicians, home care workers and public school employees.
Service Employees International Union
1800 Massachusetts Ave. NW
Washington, DC 20036
202-730-7000
seiu.org
Transport Workers Union of America
The Transport Workers Union represents a variety of workers within the transportation industry such as subway workers, airline workers, bus drivers and railroad workers as well as workers in casinos. The union counts more than 200,000 members from across 22 states, as of 2010.
Transport Workers Union of America
1700 Broadway, 2nd Floor
New York, NY 10019
212-259-4900
twu.org
UAW International
The UAW International union represents more than 1 million total workers, both retired and current, as of 2010. Most of the members work in manufacturing jobs and build items including heavy trucks, household appliances, farm equipment, musical instruments and automobiles.
UAW International
Solidarity House
8000 E. Jefferson Ave.
Detroit, MI 48214
313-926-5000
uaw.org
Gee, and I only now posted who is covered by the AFL-CIO and SEIU - Backwards Typist
[ In Reply To ..]I knew there were others but I didn't have a lot of time today to do a thorough search....but the unions have every occupation tied up, not only this country, but around the world.
Trickle Down - Version 2.0 - FloridaMom
[ In Reply To ..]Just a few words from an \"insider\". My brother-in-law is doing 75 years in a federal prision for racketeering, tax evasion and a host of other federal charges. He ran construction unions in New York and New Jersey. Unions finance some pretty corrupt enterprises as well as unduly influence politicians. Although unions seemingly provide a good wages and benefits for its members (notice I didn\'t say a decent wage - these people are not decent), it comes at a high price. Much of what is at the core of unions politically, socially and morally corrupt this country.
I don\'t really want to say to much in this public forum because of my husband\'s family. But trust me, unions do not really have their employees\' interest at heart. It is simply a cover for something much bigger.
It depends on the union - nm
[ In Reply To ..]nm
Ummm....where is Jimmy Hoffa? oh wait... - sorry, that is ANOTHER
[ In Reply To ..]union.
1975? You want to talk about Bush and Cheney, too? - How bout Bernie Madoff and Tom Delay?
[ In Reply To ..]I wish the pubs/t-partiers could at least make a pertinent argument ONCE in a while.
When a person disappears on their watch - you will have a case.
[ In Reply To ..]wanna talk about Hillary and Vince Foster? Have not seen anyone turn up dead around Bush or Cheney or Bernie Madoff or Tom Delay. Wanna talk about Barney Frank's live-in lover's male prostitution ring operating out of Barney"s town house?
Do we really want to drag out ALL the skeletons..I wish the left/liberal/Democrat/progressive name d'jour would stop throwing crap around hoping it will stick.
The thread was about UNIONS. Jimmy Hoffa-Teamsters Union.
You can't even stay on thread and you lecture. LOL.
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