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WOW. That's all I can say. I'm speechless.
Posted: May 8, 2010
This is the first time I've ever been on this board and I wandered here when I saw a post that interested me when I saw the last post read field above. I have never seen so much fighting among people who claim to have faith in ANY God or higher power. Do none of you practice what you preach? It doesn't matter if you're atheist, Christian, Buddhist, or whatever. If you claim to follow your beliefs and your beliefs are based on a religion, NONE of you would do your diety proud.
;
Wow right back at you! - Faithless
[ In Reply To ..]Personally, I am not a member of any organized religion, I do not believe in any deity, and I have no faith in any god or higher power. Therefore, I guess I am exempt from your judgment!
So then you come on here and wag your - FingerOfJudgment...
[ In Reply To ..]...at everyone you deem to be behaving inappropriately.
Sorta makes you one of them now, doesn't it?
disagree with - finger of judgment
[ In Reply To ..]Personally, I didn't interpret the original poster as someone passing judgment.
The remark sounded pretty reasonable to me.
Actually, the OP is make rather broad generalizations about ALL religions. - BornAgainMT
[ In Reply To ..]Basically, she is saying that we should all "practice what we preach" assuming that all religions are based on peaceful and loving concepts. Let's not forget, those were religious muslims that flew jets into the towers. And I would theorize that they believed they were absolutely practicing what they preached. So her theory is flawed.
I assume (correct me if I am wrong) that the conversation that so offended your sense of religion and morality was the discussion below that I myself participated in. I am a conservative Christian. By posting my beliefs, arguing the validity of those beliefs, and yes even the belief that Christianity is the one true path to the one true God, IS practicing what I preach. The Great Commission is a very fundamental Christian doctrine, as is the Trinity, and the belief that only through Jesus Christ will one know God. So I was very clearly adhering to my faith and practicing what I preach.
This board is for religious discussion. And maybe debate at times. So if you are looking for warm fuzzies, go to church, watch the Hallmark channel, or read one of those Chicken Soup for the Soul books. But if you want lively, intelligent discussion... well you get the picture.
Here's the thing... - see message
[ In Reply To ..]You spend your first paragraph discussing why "practice what you preach" is an unreliable idea.
Then, you spend your second paragraph explaining that all you are doing is "practicing what you preach".
Each conclusion is based on an assumption. It's really a mess.
As for your third paragraph, I am not looking for warm fuzzies, so you can spare me the condescension and the chicken soup.
I don't hear the OP to be making "broad generalizations" about all religions. (Though I did hear the names of other religions in a sentence....) I hear the OP as dismayed that the post below is so unkind and judgmental. I don't blame her.
Despite your assertion, this is the "Faith Board", not the "Religion Board".
Yes, it is the faith board, but what kind of faith are talking about here? - BornAgainMT
[ In Reply To ..]Faith that my toilet paper is absorbant enough? Faith that my toaster won't burn my toast?
No, we are talking religious faith. Faith that comes from believing in something bigger than ourselves. Like it or not, religion is the byproduct of faith. We discover ancient texts that point to a higher, divine power, we have faith that these texts were indeed inspired by a divine power, we then develop a religion which encompasses those texts and our faith and we asked that others who have the same kind of faith join us.
So while this board is called the "faith board" the discussions will inevitably turn to religion.
Now my commen about "broad generalizations.." simply means the OP has decided that if you are a member of religion -- whatever religion that may be -- then we should be loving and kind all of the time. She is making the assumption that ALL religions are the same in that basic tenet which as we all know is not true.
Being religious, does not automatically make you kind and loving.
Muslims view those outside their religion as heretics and wish them death.
Christians view those outside their religion as lost, and try to convert them.
Both are practicing what they preach. I never said practicing what we preach is an unreliable idea. I'm saying that practicing what you preach is relative.
I rest my - case
[ In Reply To ..].
Christians are some of the worst people I know - its sad
[ In Reply To ..]I can't speak to the other religions because I haven't had much contact with them. But in my life, Christians have been some of the worst people I have ever known, judgmental, argumentative and petty. Professing to be a Christian and then turning around and talking about someone, either behind their back or even straight to their face. At one time, I had started going to a Christian church. But honestly, once I saw what a lot of these people were really like, it totally turned me off.
So yes, I can understand your reaction to all of the fighting among the people on this board. If this is what people who believe in God do and act like, then I want no part of it.
Christians - CBR
[ In Reply To ..]As a Christian, I know I am not perfect, and I would never claim to be. I am a sinner and have been saved by the grace of God and his son Jesus.
It is not my place to pass judgment on others. It is my place to share the love of God and Jesus. The best way I can do this is to be there for people. I can listen, I can offer assistance, and if they are looking, I can share my love of God.
I try to never criticize other religions and those who follow them. I do, however, slip up in many areas of my life, as I said, I am not perfect. Jesus does not call us to be perfect. He hung out with the sinners, lol.
It is sad that many people feel this way about Christians, however, I can certainly understand why they do. Who wants to hang out with a hypocrits. Not me.
Talk about judgmental.... - PLT
[ In Reply To ..]You're the pot calling the kettle black. "Christians" are like anybody else. They sin, they make mistakes, they hurt other people. "Christian" simply means they are following Christ and His teachings but still making mistakes along the way. No one will ever be like Christ. Never... Anyone who expects Christians to be anything close to our Lord and Savior is certainly out of touch with reality. Christians strive daily to do what's right, even though they fall short constantly but those who DON'T count themselves as "Christians" are basically saying they want no part of Christ and that I find even sadder than the Christians who do not measure up to another's expectations. You don't know what's in a person's heart. Only Christ knows and when a person has done wrong, they may be sorry and ask for forgiveness. You will NEVER know. Those who profess to be "Christian" and stumble and fall don't turn me off nearly as much as those who outright turn their back on Christ and deny Him by their very actions/behaviors/beliefs, i.e., abortion, homosexuality, prostitution, drug abuse, thievery, fraud, abuse of family, divorce and all other sorts of corruption while at the same time condemning Christians because they don't appear perfect.
I am not being judgmental - just being truthful
[ In Reply To ..]I apologize if I offended you, or any other Christian, with my opinion. I was simply stating my opinion as it relates to my own personal experiences.
True, there are good and bad people, both Christian and non-Christian.
But again, in my experience (I wish I could underline that--in my experience), Christians are some of the worst people that I know. Not one of them stood by me or came forward to help me when my life fell apart. But, my non-Christian friends did.
Then, I would say that... - PLT
[ In Reply To ..]in your experience, the people who actually came forward to help you were the true "Christians" regardless of whether they profess to be or not. Those who mimick Christ as best they can would be considered Christians. :)
Very well said - Been hurt badly
[ In Reply To ..]I agree totally with your post. Many years ago I was accused of doing something horrible at the church where I was a member. The people there were closer than some family members. I was asked to leave the church over something I not only did not do, but something I didn't even consider. For quite some time I nearly lost my faith. Then I realized that we should never look to man. We need to look to God. If we put our faith in mankind we will be let down time and time again. Thank you for posting this. As you said, Christians are people like everyone else, subject to failure. Christ died so we can be forgiven. You said it all.
I'm so sorry for you...sm - PLT
[ In Reply To ..]but so happy to hear you still have your faith. I think Christians tend to be more judgemental because they have their own guilts to justify. Instead of dealing with their own, they look to point the finger at others to make them feel better about themselves. While not all are this way, I've found that seems to be the trend but we have to look past these "faults" and remember that God is our judge and no one else. I've never been accused of anything I haven't done by church members and I feel so bad that that happened to you. I have been criticized for certain things which never made me lose my faith but it did keep me away from church for so many years. We always have lived really far out in the sticks, sometimes 70-90 miles from the nearest church and I was only able to make it once, maybe twice a month, to church. There were a couple of church members who accused me of not being a "good" Christian and coming every week. I was told that if I "really" loved the Lord, I would be willing to make sacrifices to be in church every week. This really hurt me because we have 3 children and I felt the sacrifices I made was for them....food, clothes, medical care, etc. which took precedence over gas to drive 140 miles every week. I know how you feel and I'm happy to hear you haven't given up your faith. God loves us when no one else does and He can be found all around us, not just in a church building. :)
Thanks so much - Been hurt badly
[ In Reply To ..]It is so nice to "talk" to someone about this. I used to do very much singing in my church. Almost every week I would sing a solo, especially in the evening service. I loved it and it made up a big part of my life. When things fell apart and I left my church my heart felt like it would never heal. I have never, ever found a church home since. I visit from time to time, but I can't feel at home. I also don't want to be involved, just want to sit quietly and get from the music and sermon what I can. I will say that Christians are to strive to be an example. True, we are human beings and make mistakes, but what was done to me as a young woman of 21 is unthinkable. When I got word of the names I was being called and the fact that one member of a large, influential family in the church said behind my back that I had no right to get up in front of people to sing it was just too much for me. I thank you for responding. I think you did just what you were called on to do. I know when I stand before God all memories and hurt from this incident will be gone. I know that God saw what really happened. I need no ask forgiveness for what I was accused of. It never happened, but part of me will hurt forever.
WOW - Linda
[ In Reply To ..]I love this board. It is the closest thing I have found to reality in a long time. I get to laugh several times a day, I learn many things several times a day, and I get to feel connected many times a day. So, go to church if you are looking for Christians.
The moral majority is neither - fickle finger of fate
[ In Reply To ..]What one says on a message board and what one actually does IRL can be vastly different. Let's assume some people come here to let off steam so they can go back to "loving their neighbors as themselves" with a better attitude.
the good and the bad - newvhmt
[ In Reply To ..]I just have one thing to say. There are good and bad christians. There are good and bad Jews. There are good and bad athiests, etc. As a christian myself, I cringe sometimes when I see what other "christians" and even other religions say on here (and lots of different forums). But that isn't supposed to stop us from doing what is right. If you stand back and say that you don't go to church because of the backstabbing and gossip, then YOU are the person that the church needs most. We need MORE of these people who are nonjudgemental, who don't gossip, who don't backstab. There are plenty of us christians who don't do these things, but the few who do give not only our church or religion a bad rap, but God also. It becomes a spiraling problem then. You quit going to church, then you don't raise your children in church ( which doesn't mean they won't come to God in their own time, but it could and probably will make it more difficult), and so on and so on. Each generation will become more distant from God and more reliable on self. I've lived both ways, and I can honestly say that when I tried to live MY life MY way, I totally screwed it up. Sometimes I done okay for myself, but I was still unhappy. Only when I turned my will and my life over to God did things really change for me. There are, of course, exceptions to every rule, and some ppl may feel they do alright for themselves without any higher being or power...I wish I could somehow take what I have and give it to others..like taking a piece of good cake and letting someone else try it so they can see how great it is and go get their own.
I think you might have misunderstood me - I am not a Christian
[ In Reply To ..]I apologize if I wasn't clear, but it had been a long day yesterday when I posted and I was very tired.
When I said that I had started going to a Christian church at one time, it was as a non-Christian. I had started going there to see if I could learn more about this God that everyone was always talking about. But once I saw what these Christians were really like, I knew that I wanted no part in being associated with people like that.
Then I had a major catastrophe in my life not too long ago. My husband died unexpectedly at a young age, and starting then and over the course of the next year, I was hospitalized three times, two with extended ICU stays and I almost died twice.
But during this troubled time, which still continues to even to this day, everyone I knew who was a "Christian" was no where to be found. It was like they all just disappeared, and it was my non-Christian friends who were (and still are) my biggest support, always willing to help and to be there when I need them. And all of my "Christian" friends are still missing in action.
I had originally gone to that church to try to find out who God was. But after seeing what this God's people were really like, first at the church, and then through my own personal catastrophe, I decided that I just don't need a God like that. I had been told that this was a "loving" God, but from my own personal experience, it sure doesn't seem that he is and he sure does have an awful lot of unloving people associated with him.
Just wanted to add this. I am an atheist and I - want to thank you and PLT
[ In Reply To ..]for your posts. I sometimes frequent the politics board, although much less lately due to so little tolerance among the posters. Today, there is a thread about acceptance of gays as people and not responding with condemnation and that only God should be doing that. Otherwise, they are just members of the human family. When this topic comes up, I see, without exception, someone who claims to be a "Christian" who does not understand that tolerance and acceptance is something that God and Christ would want, rather than intolerance and judgement. I thank you, humbly and from the heart for reassuring me that there are some Christians that really ARE Christians. I have no problem with any religion, only with people who are so eager to profess their so-called faith and then turn around and act in a way that is contrary to Christ's teachings. BTW, I was brought up Presbyterian and converted as a teen to LDS so I am not without a religious background, and will add that I would probably have committed suicide as a teen had it none been for the wonderful people at church. I no longer agree with them in terms of religion, but they were among the most "Christian" people I knew and I have fond memories of them.
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