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OMG - I HAVE A PROBLEM!!!

Posted: Sep 9, 2010

I have a dilemma. I brought in a woman to rent my room on Saturday for 200.00 without a lease. Within 3 hours, the entire house reeked of very strong cinnamon incense. Fine...then comes Sunday, she begins by making coffee in my coffee pot and cleaning my kitchen counters, her first load of clothes goes in at at 9 AM and she washes clothes until late that night. She puts her dish towels in place and takes it upon herself to wash mine. She then finds a Sun-Tea container in my garage, makes iced tea and put it in the fridge - this is within 24 hours. It is like she has taken over the kitchen. When I walked in, she kept going, and I had no choice but to stand there and watch her (small kitchen).

The next morning, she is up making coffee. I walk in and ask her if she could use her own coffee pot since I like mine stronger than she does and I am also worried about the appliance burning out sooner than usual (I am broke...). She turns around and puts her hand on my stomach, to the side and it gives me chills as rather than a touch of familiarity, it feels like an invasion somehow with the proximity. I was appalled.

I immediately said: I do not think I am going to be able to live with you. She stated she felt the same and said "I don't have time to talk about this now" in a manner that was actually angry enough that I felt frightened. It has been 4 days, she is still here and refuses to talk about it. I offered to return her money and pay her an additional 150.00 to move out immediately. She just smiled at me.

To be on safe side, I sent her e-mail with 30-day notice. Her daughter e-mailed me back saying I was a psycho nut. That if I wanted her out, to go to the court house "that it would only cost a couple hundred dollars" and that "I should brush up on landlord tennant laws if I want to be a landlord." I called her on the phone and she hung up on me.

I have about 30 dollars in my checking account. I am contemplating packing up her things while she is at work and setting them outside of my house with the money in an envelope. This is a nightmare and I know I did wrong but I had to have help with the bills since I lost a job a few months ago and am back at new job but for the first few months, my income is at the bottom of the scale.

Please do not tell me how foolish I am. I was not thinking right when interviewing her. Her presentation was very professional and she was quite articulate. Honestly, if she would have just stayed in her room (master bedroom with sliding glass door to backyard, own bath, huge room with sitting area) and not invaded my kitchen (or used the washer and dryer all day long - power bill will be high), this would not be happening. I did have clothes in the closet and went in to get them and saw she had put a glass of water by the door as a booby trap. Then I saw that she had hid some of my clothes in the farther end of the closet - I had them on hangers, she rolled them up in a ball and tucked them under a stand.)

I know I have to go to the court house and deal with this obnoxious woman for 3 more weeks but can anyone give me advice on how I can manage to live her with her and not have a ball of anxiety in my gut? This stress is unbearable. If I had more cash, I'd offer it to her. This morning, she left for work with the tea kettle on the stove and the flame on - now what does that mean? She is a coffee drinker!!!! There are 3 gallons of iced tea in the fridge! Is she intimidating me? I am terrified.

;

OMG - Been there done that

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You got any big burly friends or neighbors. Also family can be helpful. I had to move someone out and I paid movers with an IOU to move this person out and had my friends there for support.

I was thinking about a neighbor - SM

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I have no family but I do have a neighbor up the street. I will give him a call and ask him to stop by and visit me. There is also another tennant, a young man, who realizes the situation, said that he stated she came on strong when he introduced herself and figured she would be a problem. He is a student and delivers pizza in the evening. Today, he whispered good-bye to me, and I have a feeling he did it so that she would not hear him leave.

This is dreadful.

Thank you. I am calling a moving company tomorrow. Thank God, she does not have furniture. I will pay to have it stored with a payday advance loan, and she can figure it out.

As I typed this out, it occurred to me that immediately making the house smell like "cinnamon" was intrusive in itself and that she is using tactics, whether conscious or otherwise, to establish her presense in my home. Good Lord!

Here is what I would do - travelinMT

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Since she has no lease and has only been there for a few days, put all of her stuff outside and call the police. When they come out ask them if you can call them back out when she returns to "keep the peace" while she gets her belongings. Do this immediately, as some states make you evict someone if they have lived there over 30 days. Make sure you get the key from her while the police are there. Then I would go to the court house and get a restraining order, she is a nut case! You might also want to check the "public records" you might find out she has a history of this and you also will be able to find out if she had done anything in retaliation to anyone before you. I know you say you are broke, but I would invest in either having a locksmith re-key your locks or put new locks on your doors just in case she has already made another key.

It's a hard lesson to learn but don't ever let anyone move into your house until you check them out thoroughly first. Yes, those checks cost money but they save you alot of headaches in the end. Good Luck!

You can't just kick her out... - Kendra

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that would be an illegal eviction. You owe her notice and, to be honest, it doesn't sound like she is all that bad. If these are the worst things she has done (use the kitchen and laundry and make iced tea and coffee), it sounds like you hit the jackpot for a roommate (having had plenty). Did you expect that she would only use the washer when it was convenient for you and stay in her room (as you said)? She rented a room in the house, but that usually comes with kitchen and laundry privileges and it really sounds to me like you are being a little unreasonable. I would have killed to have a roommate who cleaned the kitchen and I really don't care whose towels she used! Maybe rethink having a roommate at all, but in the meantime, give her her 30 days (from the 1st in most states) to move out. If it makes you feel any better, I just found out that the tenants in my house have allowed their children to write all over the walls and turned my pump house into a chicken coop! Cleaning the kitchen and making iced tea are mild!

Tenant - cj

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I'd kick her to the curb. Even though she rents there and rents the space of the kitchen and wash, she seems like she is taking over like its "her" house. There are still rules that you may enforce as the landlord and if she doesn't follow them, then she should go. There are real nuts out there and she seems like one. You have to be careful for your personal safety. You were there with this woman and in the situation and if she makes you feel like you are in danger...trust your gut. I agree with getting police involved or a few big guys to be there to overlook her making her exit. Put her stuff outside where it won't be stolen and change your locks. Just my opinion...

The thing is that if she pays rent.... - Kendra

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it is her house. She is not destroying anything or threatening anyone. The OP can do what she wants, but kicking her out is illegal. It sounds to me like the OP really doesn't want a roommate and is awfully territorial. She said, "Honestly, if she would have just stayed in her room (master bedroom with sliding glass door to backyard, own bath, huge room with sitting area) and not invaded my kitchen (or used the washer and dryer all day long - power bill will be high), this would not be happening." Why should anyone have to "stay in her room" when she pays rent. This woman doesn't want a roommate, but she agreed to it and just throwing her stuff out and kicking her out is not only illegal, it is immoral. Try to put yourself in the position of the woman who rented the room. Honestly, who gets mad when a roommate cleans? I would think that washing dish towels is a good thing for a roommate to do. This, of course, is just my opinion, but you CANNOT legally just kick someone out for using the laundry and cleaning the kitchen.

I have to agree - there is a personal safety issue

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She has been going through things that are not hers, taking stuff out of the garage without permission, touching in a threatening manner, and her daughter has sent what sounds like a threatening email. On top of that, she is essentially hiding from the OP to avoid eviction and has refused a very reasonable monetary offer to find another place to live. She is clearly trying to bully her way into staying. While she has some rights, she has basically waived them by her behavior.

OP needs to contact the police and evict the woman immediately, with a refund and with changed locks. I also agree about the restraining order suggested by someone else.

You can't kick someone out because you feel... - Kendra

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threatened, unless there is an actual threat. When I was in college, I had a roommate who moved her boyfriend in and he got angry with me and told me that he hoped I died. To me, that seemed threatening; to the police, it was not. He did not directly threaten me, did not say he hoped he killed me, et cetera, and I felt he was menacing me at the time, but it really doesn't matter. We can't know for sure that this woman placing her hand on the other woman (what sounded like gently) was meant to be threatening or not. And the smile...I think I'd be terrified. She has rights. She has a right to 30 days notice, which has not been waived, basically or otherwise. I would hate to see the OP take this poor advice and end up owing someone a lot of money, rather than being uncomfortable for a short while and chalking it up to a bad decision.

It is legal as they have no signed contract. - RoadrunnerMT

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The longer she is there, the more entitlement she can prove. Get her out now before it is too late.

No, it is not legal. - Kendra

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it makes it easier to lie and get away with it, but it is not legal.

Kendra is right. And sometimes, it can actually be - s/m

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harder to remove tenants without a lease, that those who have one.

I once lived in an apartment complex where this 1-bedroom apt. was rented by 2 college girls. Soon, 2 of their friends were living with them (not on the lease). Eventually there were 7 of them living in a 1-bedroom apartment! Only by this time, the original 2 who had signed a lease were long gone. The remaining 7 had no lease at all!

The landlord had set about evicting them, but because now there was no one there on the lease, and they WERE paying rent, it took much, much longer, because there were more legal hoops to jump through. All the landlord could do in the meantime was tell them that 5 of them had to go, because the law in that area stated a 1-bedroom could only be occupied by 2 non-related adults.

I don't know if the laws differ between renting an apartment in a complex, and renting a room in a house. I guess that may vary from state to state.

As a person who once rented rooms in houses, they always came with full house privileges, as long as I contributed to restocking the fridge, cleaning, etc.

It's possible that maybe there was a misunderstanding when the OP rented her house, and it was just assumed that the tenant would stay in her room, and the tenant just assumed she'd have house privileges. It, too, would rather have a housemate that helps out, rather than one who just takes advantage. But this is probably a case where personalities are clashing. Certainly a good enough reason to terminate a tenancy, but I agree that just throwing all her stuff to the curb would be illegal. If it were me, I would give written 30-day notice, and state that it's "just not working out for personal reasons".

Exactly - she was taking over! - OP

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When she pulled out the sun-tea jar and used it, I was completely flabbergasted. I had not used it because it leaked and told her - she said she had fixed it. Well, guess what my fridge looks like today? Iced tea all over everywhere - worse! she has seen it and has not cleaned it up!

She is rude and arrogant. Her daughter scares me. the last line of her e-mail was "don't bother me anymore."

I am working tomorrow but on my day off (Sunday) I will confront this issue. When I work, I can't afford to be upset as we all know that can lead to an error. She totally acts like I don't exist, walking about the place like she has a right to be here.

It is freaking strange. I wish I had a weapon.

I 100% agree with you. She paid rent and has rights. - nm

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x

landlord tenant - longtimemt

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I may be wrong but in my state if there is no lease you can simpy put her out and change the locks or call the police to put her out, she has no legal rights. Check with them, call your local police department and tell them the situation. You owe her nothing, she would have spent that much in a motel, it may cost you to change your locks but it would give you peace of mind. I would definitely get it on record at the police department in case she retaliates. GET HER OUT NOW

In most states, if there is no written lease... - Kendra

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there is an implied month-to-month lease, which requires a 30 day notice to ask someone to leave. You cannot just kick people out with no time to find a place to live. That is ridiculous. It is hard enough to kick evict someone who is not paying rent--you still cannot put there stuff out and change the locks.

The kick doesn't belong and I really do know how.... - Kendra

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to use there, their and they're, just typed in a hurry. Should have been their. :)

I am thinking on your lines - sm

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I totally agree with your posts above. I can just see this one going to court to get her out, "She came out of her room and washed some of my clothes and made coffee." Seriously, what would a judge say to that? I would think the homeowner would have to pay something to the roommate for renting them a room with those expectations.

If she does all the things mentioned, I may need you to send her my way. Maybe I can find a room for her.

I don't think you will have that big of a problem getting her out. She is probably just a miserable as you mentioned she knows it is not working. Probably need to give her time to find somewhere as she may have paid you all she has. Can you really use the police? That would be like the police meeting you at your apartment that you rented and telling you to get out now. Nothing seems legal about that.

Later the story changed and - OP

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This lady is white trash and not a victim of the economy. She cannot get work because she attempted to file a worker's comp claim fraudulently - and has to answer "yes" to the question "have you ever filed a worker's comp claim" during employment paperwork. She apparently has lived with her daughter and granddaughter, living on welfare. My greatest fear is theft and slip and fall in the house. She is obtrusive - any women here don't know to not to take over a kitchen within the first 48 hours when moving into another woman's home?

I was a roommate in my 20s. I was very conscientious of the rules, and left no trace of myself outside of my room. Everywhere I went, there she was. When she started looking through my things - she had to have done that to find the sun-tea container in a dark garage, it upset me.

200.00 a month, no deposit, no last month, furnished masterbed = a good deal in California. She should have stayed within her room and simply been polite.

A roommate who thinks that she should... - Kendra

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"have stayed within her room and simply been polite" = not a good deal anywhere. Maybe you are not coming across the way you really are, but I am beginning to think that her daughter was right. Again, I would think that cleaning the kitchen would be a positive thin and what you are failing to see is that it is no longer just your home. She is not in "another woman's home," she is in her home that she shares with another woman. If you wanted a house guest or a child to boss around, you should not have charged her rent. I imagine that the best thing to do would be to give her notice and stick it out, which I doubt will be pleasant for either one of you.

I'm just wondering how this woman was supposed to eat? - LoriMT

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If she shouldn't be allowed in the kitchen for the first 48 hours?

Honestly, I'm with Kendra on this one. It doesn't sound like this woman has done anything outrageous aside from putting her hand on the OP's stomach (that was a little odd).

I would say that the OP is the one behaving outrageously. Worried about the coffee maker going bad? You can get a cheap coffee maker at Wal-Mart for 10 bucks. Upset because the woman washed her kitchen towels and then replaced them with her own. And upset because she made the house smell like cinnamon. There are worse things the house could smell like.

Having said all that, I live in Missouri and that law her says as long as she hasn't established residence, i.e. getting any mail at the house, you can pretty much ask her to leave with very little notice. Give her back her money and ask her to go. If she refuses, put her stuff outside and change the locks. If she is already receiving mail at your house, then you will have to go through the court and it will take up to 90 days.

I had an oral lease agreement with a tenant who rented a house from me. She was dating one of my ex-husband's cousins (I was still married at the time). Anyway, she never paid rent, not even for one month. We showed up to the house and told her we wanted her out. The conversation got heated and my husband basically followed her through our house yelling at her. She called the cops and we were asked to leave our own house. She had established residence there, utilities were in her name, getting mail, etc. and we could not, even as the property owners, show up, barge in, and demand our rent. We had to give her notice in writing and take her to court which we did and it took 90 days to get her out and she stayed there everyone of those 90 days.

A different opinion - Just me

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She sounds like she came on very strong and tried to take over. I don't think she should have gone in the garage and got the owner's tea maker unless she at least asked first. I don't think she has a right to be doing laundry all day long, and replacing the owner's kitchen towels with her own, etc. Sounds very bold to me, and I know I would not appreciate her being in my home. I hope it all works out, but I think she sounds like trouble.

I agree. Once I was looking at rooms to rent, and - there was this wonderful, huge - sm

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master bedroom upstairs, with big windows, an oak tree outside with squirrels, hardwood floors, huge closet and bathroom. But as the woman and I talked, I realized it wasn't going to work because she expected me to just stay in my room. She said I could keep food in the fridge, and use the microwave but not the oven, and that I'd have to eat in my room, not the kitchen. I had always just watched TV in the family room of homes where I'd lived before, and she said no, I'd have to get my own TV to watch in my room. Also, I wasn't allowed to have my own microwave or hot plate up there. I also tend to keep pretty late hours, and am up late or come home late, and her family went to bed by 9 PM. She wanted me in my room by 9, because the stairs squeaked really bad, and she said if I came home late, it would wake her and the kids up when I climbed them. So, short of hanging an escape ladder out my bedroom window or something, I knew that the situation there just wasn't going to work out.

Look at this - Good Luck!! - cj

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I just googled this. This is even based on having a signed lease, which you don't have. I hope it comes out ok below.

This is the actual link to the site. http://www.dca.ca.gov/publications/landlordbook/terminations.shtml

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However, the landlord can terminate the tenancy by giving the tenant only three days' advance written notice if the tenant has done any of the following:276

Failed to pay the rent.
Violated any provision of the lease or rental agreement.
Materially damaged the rental property ("committed waste").
Substantially interfered with other tenants ("committed a nuisance").
Committed domestic violence or sexual assault against, or stalked another tenant or subtenant on the premises.277
Used the rental property for an unlawful purpose.278
Engaged in drug dealing, unlawfully used, cultivated, imported, or manufactured illegal drugs.
Unlawful conduct involving weapons or ammunition.279

but then, here is the rest of the story... - Kendra

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Overview of the eviction process

If the tenant doesn't voluntarily move out after the landlord has properly given the required notice to the tenant, the landlord can evict the tenant. In order to evict the tenant, the landlord must file an unlawful detainer lawsuit in superior court.

In an eviction lawsuit, the landlord is called the "plaintiff" and the tenant is called the "defendant."

Call us today!
Unlawful detainer lawsuit

An unlawful detainer lawsuit is a "summary" court procedure. This means that the court action moves forward very quickly, and that the time given the tenant to respond during the lawsuit is very short. For example, in most cases, the tenant has only five days to file a written response to the lawsuit after being served with a copy of the landlord's complaint. Normally, a judge will hear and decide the case within 20 days after the tenant files an answer.

The court-administered eviction process assures the tenant of the right to a court hearing if the tenant believes that the landlord has no right to evict the tenant. The landlord must use this court process to evict the tenant; the landlord cannot use self-help measures to force the tenant to move. For example, the landlord cannot physically remove or lock out the tenant, cut off utilities such as water or electricity, remove outside windows or doors, or seize (take) the tenant's belongings in order to carry out the eviction. The landlord must use the court procedures.

If the landlord uses unlawful methods to evict a tenant, the landlord may be subject to liability for the tenant's damages, as well as penalties of up to $100 per day for the time that the landlord used the unlawful methods./p>

In an unlawful detainer lawsuit, the court holds a hearing at which the parties can present their evidence and explain their case. If the court finds that the tenant has a good defense, the court will not evict the tenant. If the court decides in favor of the tenant, the tenant will not have to move, and the landlord may be ordered to pay court costs (for example, the tenant's filing fees). The landlord also may have to pay the tenant's attorney's fees, if the rental agreement contains an attorney's fee clause and if an attorney represented the tenant.
Writ of Possession

If the court decides in favor of the landlord, the court will issue a writ of possession. The writ of possession orders the sheriff to remove the tenant from the rental unit, but gives the tenant five days from the date that the writ is served to leave voluntarily. If the tenant does not leave by the end of the fifth day, the writ of possession authorizes the sheriff to physically remove and lock the tenant out, and seize (take) the tenant's belongings that have been left in the rental unit. The landlord is not entitled to possession of the rental unit until after the sheriff has removed the tenant.

The court also may award the landlord any unpaid rent if the eviction is based on the tenant's failure to pay rent. The court also may award the landlord damages, court costs, and attorney's fees (if the rental agreement or lease contains an attorney's fee clause and if the landlord was represented by an attorney). If the court finds that the tenant acted maliciously in not giving up the rental unit, the court also may award the landlord up to $600 as a penalty. The judgment against the tenant will be reported on the tenant's credit report for seven years.

The URL is http://www.expressevictions.com/california-eviction-procedure.php

Cop said if she isn't getting mail here I can kick her out. - Thank you very much

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I can't address this while i am working - it is too exhausting emotionally. Sunday is my day off, and Monday. So, I will keep you updated.

Thank you very much for your information.

I think I might talk to a lawyer before I did that... - anon

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The cop might not know what he is talking about. Remember, they are not lawyers and probably are not brushed up on the intricacies of landlord/tenant law. As for your comment that she is "freaking strange," that's what I thought about you. If the daughter asked you to not to bother her anymore, it seems that she is the more rational of the two of you. As for the inconsistencies in your post, I am not quite sure what to make of them. You say this woman went to work, then you say she has no job. It seems that you are just trying to make her sound worse because you know you are wrong. I am beginning to believe that none of this is true.

Here you go... - Kendra

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Unfortunately, because you sent her an e-mail giving her notice, you cannot claim that she is not a tenant (although I clearly think that this is the wrong thing to do anyway-Why make yourself a liar?) As a landlord, I know that it is very difficult to evict someone and takes a long time to do it legally. Many states have punitive damages for breaking these laws.

How Evictions Work: What Renters Need to Know
Landlords can't just lock you out, even if you are behind on rent. They must get a court judgment first.
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Your landlord can't evict you without terminating the tenancy first. This usually means giving you adequate written notice, in a specified way and form. If you don't move after proper notice (or reform your ways -- for example, by paying the rent or finding a new home for the dog), the landlord can file a lawsuit to evict you. (This type of lawsuit is sometimes called an unlawful detainer, or UD lawsuit.) In order to win, the landlord must prove that you did something wrong that justifies ending the tenancy.

State laws have very detailed requirements for landlords who want to end a tenancy. Each state has its own procedures as to how termination notices and eviction papers must be written and delivered to you ("served"). Landlords must follow state rules and procedures exactly.
Notice of Termination for Cause

Although terminology varies somewhat from state to state, there are basically three types of termination notices that you might receive if you have violated the rental agreement or lease in some way:

* Pay Rent or Quit Notices are typically given to you when you have not paid the rent. These notices give you a few days (three to five in most states) to pay the rent or move out ("quit").
* Cure or Quit Notices are typically given to you if you violate a term or condition of the lease or rental agreement, such as a no-pets clause or the promise to refrain from making excessive noise. Usually, you have a set amount of time in which to correct, or "cure," the violation.
* Unconditional Quit Notices are the harshest of all. They order you to vacate the premises with no chance to pay the rent or correct a lease or rental agreement violation. In most states, unconditional quit notices are allowed only if you have:
o repeatedly violated a significant lease or rental agreement clause
o been late with the rent on more than one occasion
o seriously damaged the premises, or
o engaged in serious illegal activity, such as drug dealing on the premises.

Notice of Termination Without Cause

Even if you have not violated the rental agreement and have not been late paying rent, a landlord can usually ask you to move out at any time (assuming you don't have a fixed term lease) as long as the landlord gives you a longer notice period.

A 30-Day Notice to Vacate or a 60-Day Notice to Vacate to terminate a tenancy can be used in most states when the landlord does not have a reason to end the tenancy. (The length of the required notice can be slightly longer or shorter in some states.)

Rent Control Exceptions. Many rent control cities, however, go beyond state laws and require the landlord to prove a legally recognized reason for termination. These laws are known as "just cause eviction protection." (Tenants in only a couple of states -- New Jersey and New Hampshire -- also enjoy just cause eviction protection.)
Eviction Lawsuit

Following receipt of a termination notice, if you haven't moved out or fixed the lease or rental agreement violation, the landlord must properly serve you with a summons and complaint for eviction in order to proceed with the eviction.
Possible Defenses

If you do get hauled into court, you may be able to diminish the landlord's chances of victory. Perhaps you can point to shoddy paperwork in the preparation of the eviction lawsuit. Or maybe the landlord's illegal behavior, such as not maintaining the rental property in habitable condition, will serve as a good defense, as would a claim that the eviction lawsuit is in retaliation for your insistence on needed, major repairs.
Sheriff's Escort

Even if the landlord wins the eviction lawsuit, the landlord can't just move you and your things out onto the sidewalk. Landlords must give the court judgment to a local law enforcement office, along with a fee. A sheriff or marshal gives you a notice that the officer will be back within a few days to escort you off the property. At that point, it's best to acknowledge defeat and leave on your own steam.

If you're a renter and want more information on evictions, see Every Tenant's Legal Guide, by Janet Portman and Marcia Stewart (Nolo).

I'd put here stuff on the curb and bring a huge mean dog inside - to meet her at the door. LOL

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Preferably, borrow someone's security or junk yard dog!

If she calls the police, I'd tell them you let her stay the night because you felt sorry for her but that was all there was to it.

Look at it like this: no body - no crime. No lease - no claim.

LOL

Do you really think that is okay? - Kendra

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What a shady thing that would be to do. By the way, there is an e-mail that verifies that she rented a room, so in this case, to stay with your metaphor, there is a body.

Yes, I do think it is okay. It is not shady. It is effective. - I'd do whatever it takes to get her out before the

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nm

It absolutely.... - Kendra

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is shady. Lying about what the agreement is so that you can illegally kick someone out of a house because you don't like her ought to be the definition of shady. If you can sleep with being a shady person, more power to you, but don't pretend that it is anything other than shady.

Bottom line ..... - travelinMT

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The OP lives in California and she is thereby bound by California law, not law from another state or another situation. This arrangement is obviously NOT going to work out!!!! So she needs to do what California law allows her to do. She can and does have the right to evict her immediately based on the fact the tenant entered her garage and went through her belongings to find something that did not belong to her. She is renting a room not the owner's belongings. She should have asked before using the washer and dryer all day long. Did she have laundry priviledges or was it something she just helped herself to? Usually when you rent a "room" you rent a "room" not the garage, or the items that belong to the owner. Some might think these things are trivial, but what we think is trivial does not matter because she has to live with the situation and we don't. I still say call the police and ask them to keep the peace while she removes her things, in Calif. they will do that. Then change the locks and get a restraining order. Based on the statements that were made "take her to court" they have pulled this before and it is just scare tactics. In Calif it is very easy to access public records at the court house to find out any prior convictions, court cases, etc. That would be more information in the OP's argument if she can document this woman does this all the time. I would put money on the fact, if she lets her stay she won't pay her rent next month. Most people in Cali would think they had died and gone to heaven to find a room for rent (including utilities for $200 a month) and they would not come in like gangbusters and try to take over. You can't rent a "room" in my neighborhood for less than $700-$900 a month. The OP made a lot of mistakes in renting to this person and the renter knows it, that is why she is going to milk it for all she can.

I spent most of my life in California and I think you are wrong... - Kendra

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Should she have taken the iced tea jar, probably not, is it grounds for eviction, probably not. Even if it is, you still have to go through the legal eviction process--especially in California.

If it wasnt stated on a lease that she couldnt enter - the garage, or make tea, or - sm

[ In Reply To ..]
do laundry, (and it wasn't, because she didn't sign a lease), then I doubt any of that is going to be considered just cause for kicking her butt to the curb without notice. Had she intentionally broken a lock to get into the garage, for example, that still would've required a warning and need for correction, but not justified an eviction. The only way I would go against the law and physically lock her out would be if she had actually come after me with a knife, pointed a gun at me, or harmed one of my pets. But then, if the tenant had done that, then I'm sure you could call the police to come remove them.

Although most of Calif. isn't rent-controlled, it does still give a lot of protection to the renter.

Although it sounds to me like maybe the woman assumed quite a lot in terms of being welcome anywhere in the house, and there are certain things that would've made me keep an eye on her, at least for a while, for the most part, I wouldn't consider doing laundry, cleaning the kitchen, or making tea to be over-the-top aggressive or pushy. It just sounds like she made herself at home very, very quickly. Maybe she was trying a little too hard to make herself welcome. Hard to say, without actually being there, of course.

That said, of course, there ARE people who are "professional squatters"... who will rent a home or apt., pay rent for a month or two, and then stop. They KNOW they'll be able to live there rent-free for 3 to 6 months or more because they've been through that before. They know the ropes. They know how to work the system. They intentionally seek out landlords who are renting for less-than-usual, and especially those who don't provide a lease to sign, although having a lease usually won't stop them, either.

That's where the background check is useful, addresses and phone numbers of previous landlords to call for references, etc. Even that isn't foolproof, however. In the building where I used to live, if the landlord wanted someone out, they would give GLOWING references for them, just to get them out of their hair sooner. I think that's unethical, and unfair to the next landlord, but lots of apt. landlords and/or managers are pretty unethical, themselves.

I think the best thing to do in this case is to evict her lawfully, and then next time, (if there IS a next time) be much, much more careful about tenant selection, have them sign a lease that specifically points out what they may or may not do in your home, and by all means, charge more for rent. That will help keep out the riff-raff.

re: roommate - helga

[ In Reply To ..]
Kendra is absolutely correct, it would be an illegal eviction. You cannot put her things out and lock the doors. You'll be in BIG trouble. You should have considered reading up on the law before you allowed a roommate in.

Also, it is NEVER easy to learn how to live with a stranger in your own home! It doesn't seem to me that these are tragic, no way in heck we can get a long circumstances. She and her daughter seem to know their rights. I'd tread carefully if I were you. (watch those court shows ever? they are chock-full of these types of dramas)

Best case scenario, serve her with a 30 day eviction notice. take the legal path. 30 days of suffering is better than being out a lof of moolah.

I hope you stay safe and hope you've learned a lesson here. Screen your tenants before, sign a lease and lay out your home rules BEFORE they move in!

I'll be sending you positive brain waves because I know this is probably a very, very frustrating situation for you.

Everything in writing - deenibeeni

[ In Reply To ..]
Don't rely on e-mail. There's a legal way to give someone notice & it involves posting a piece of paper on the door.

There are good books on Landlord/Tenant Law - I suggest you get one from the library.

For the record, it may not sound bad to someone else, but I'm with you. I'd be ready to blow my brains out. You cannot stand by & let her do this stuff. You are not sharing equally. She may have "privileges," but you are the landlord & she needs to ask your permission for things. Just because she is paying rent doesn't mean she has carte blanche to take over.

Tell her she cannot use incense in the common areas or take over the fridge with iced tea. Tell her! Or it's only going to get worse. The more you stand by & let it happen, the more aggressive she's going to get.

Hang on for a few weeks. Take a lot of deep breaths. Stand your ground.

& for what it's worth, I KNOW what a girl scout demeanor people can put on when you first meet them & how, once they aren't trying to impress you any more, the truth can come out. BD & unfortunately DT.

Roommate from **** - oaf

[ In Reply To ..]
Have to agree with some of the other posts. She doesn't sound that bad. May be you should have had all the "house rules" written before she moved in. Sorry you are down on your luck - but in this day I don't trust anyone. Sounds terrible, but God only knows what you could get. I hope things get better and she moves out on her own - but it sounds like she is digging her heels in.... and making more tea!

I'm so sorry - i've been there too. sm

[ In Reply To ..]
I lived with a crazy woman as well. Although, I should have known better, I did not listen to my gut. But, I needed to survive so went ahead with it.

She was bipolar, she drank heavily, smoked marijuana. She would give me instructions on how to clean "her way," she would go in my room. She had a party until 6 in the morning (she is 55 years old) with a live band, smoking marijuana.

The final straw was when we could not stand each other and she did little things similar to your tea kettle incident. She actually took a part from my computer so I could not work. I had already replaced one pc because it suddenly stopped working (I know it had to be her because we were having problems). I had to call the police on her because she got violent.

I am just better off living alone, or having someone who respects my space. So are you it seems. I hope it all works out for you and you don't need to spend too much money to get her out.

Yes, no more roommates for me. - OP

[ In Reply To ..]
I was going to face this on my day off (Sunday) but the lack of sleep is getting to me. So, I just went for it. Got the police involved.

She banged up the room pretty good but I suppose she doesn't want the rest of the money back. Cop said "that is why you get a deposit."

Well, I don't even care about the damage; I am so freaking happy she is out of here. It has one week. I got the gut thing and followed it. Working at home, I cannot be distracted and that was what was happening, I had a low-level humming distraction when she was here, like my body was telling me "danger Will Robinson."

So glad we both lived to tell the story. There are some real whackos out there. I am going to find a PT job somewhere.

Best regards. :)

As a renter, Ive had some roommates from **** myself. - sm - Rocky Raccoon

[ In Reply To ..]
Roommates who had no respect for me or my personal space & belongings. (Using my makeup, even having sex in my bed once. UGH!) And a total psycho landlady with 2 psycho daughters. Still, I've also had a couple of absolutely WONDERFUL landlords and a few good roommates.

However, the bad experiences far outweighed the good, in my personal experience, and after that, I swore I will only share my home with animals. I would rather live in the backseat of my car, than ever live with another human again!

Update - I got her ~out~. Original Poster - Some damage but worth it

[ In Reply To ..]
I had police come over last night while she was here. Discussed the issue. Heard her say she found a room and was leaving tomorrow. (today).

This morning, I left the house to take dogs for a walk, came back and everything was gone including a floor fan, the shower head, every light fixure on the wall, she had taken a sharp object and cut into the marble on the dresser and nightstand took all the drawer pulls, punched holes in the draws (this is a beautiful ensemble,,,or was). Wrote "You are psychotic" into the marble twice.

Phew, glad she was gone. I knew in my bones she ewas a nut and was ready to pay the price.

Thank you ladies. You gave me the right advice to get her out ASAP. She was probably about to steal my ID.

I hope you ......... - travelinMT

[ In Reply To ..]
Filed a police report. Let them arrest her and file charges against her. As long as she gets away with it she will continue to do it to whoever she rents from.

Police suggested I still evict her in courthouse - OP

[ In Reply To ..]
Police officer stated if I could afford to, to go ahead and evict her officially so that it will be on the record. I am going to hire a service to present her with the eviction notice, then her name will be listed as a tennant who was evicited, I am told, in some data base.

As the time has passed, I realize she has stolen a painting/print which my xhusband gave me in 1992. Limited edition. A wall decoration is gone, though not something I will miss.

She also tooka step ladder. In the kitchen, where she had cupboards given to her to use, she smashed up a cantaloupe and smeared it around. That is when I realized she took the step ladder. I suppose as time goes on, I will realize more that she has done.

Her big mistake was that I know where she works. I called her employer and let him know what she had done. People who are capable of such damage will do it to anyone with the right provocation.

Today is my day off, so I can finally relax and think about this. A week of actual misery has just ended and I feel like I escaped with my life.

Funny thing but I had made lunch after she had gotten her boxes in the room and was serving her freshly made iced tea...I had forgotten to put sugar in it before pouring it and when I mentioned it, she stated in a manner that was cutting steel - "pour my glass back in the picture" - like an order I must follow, do it fast, do it now and do it right this time, as if she was losing patience with me.

That moment is when my heart skipped a beat and I wondered to myself what have I gotten myself into. Of course, the rest was to follow. Crazy.

Police officer said: "when you bring people into your house to rent a room, there is a good chance they actually do not need to rent a room, they just want to get in your house."

To close this discussion as it is taking a turn to weird - OP

[ In Reply To ..]
As a single woman, who is a home owner in this economy, I looked at renting a room as an alternative to additional PT job. I had taken a hit financially due to VR and loss of ability to work OT.

At 52, I am faced with returning to college which is the last thing I want to do but I don\'t see another way availale to ensure I have an income, one that will pay the bills and allow me to save.

This situation has been a punch in the stomach but I\'ll recover because I think it isn\'t the mistakes you make but how long it takes to realize you have made a mistake and correct it.

Thank you to all of the helpful posters who saw the urgency in my writing. I am profoundly depressed and have been for some time. I am on auto pilot for the most part these days but this has awaken me - made me realize this: Yes, it is bad but it could be worse.

Thank you again. I cherish each of you who helped me with supportive words. ((((hug))). God help us all get through this economy without crushing our spirits.

Yup, I would want to end the discussion, too, - mmmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
if I got caught with my nose growing. What about the other roommate? How long has he been there? Before or after you decided to get "a" roommate? This discussion has pretty much been weird.

So happy to hear you got the problem resolved! Now - you can move forward! -Rocky Raccoon

[ In Reply To ..]
:D

why not get the locks changed... - fpamt

[ In Reply To ..]
Maybe a good idea to change the locks, even if she was not there very long. When dealing with someone unstable, we can't be too careful.

yes, call the police, get it on record about the damage - sm - ECMT

[ In Reply To ..]
though I am sure she would deny it, since it will be her word against yours. But if it is on record then happens again the police can see it is a pattern with this woman and hopefully get her locked up or the mental help she obviously needs. Yes change the locks or add another one to what you have (and use it) and also a chain too. Make sure all your window locks work too, the psycho could have dismantled all of them as well when you were not home or at night when you were sleeping. Obviously next time (if there is a next time) do a background check, clearly lay out the rules, and have them sign something whether it is a lease or tenancy agreement that gives you both a quick out if things are not working, and have it notorized/witnessesed as well.

took all these things while you were walking the dogs? - shaking head a bit

[ In Reply To ..]
Do you know how long it takes to do all of the mischief you are claiming she did? Good grief, I take my dog on a walk, but not so long as to remove all the light fixtures on the walls, remove the shower head, punch holes in drawers and scratch words in marble...twice.

I'm not really buying into your story anymore. If you knew she was going to leave, and you were so concerned that you called the police to come to you home, any logical thinker would not leave the home unsupervised for any length of time, much less for the amount of time it would take to do what you said she did.

If it doesn't make sense, it isn't the truth.

Her son helped her move. - OP To answer your question

[ In Reply To ..]
I have a feeling she cut into the marble overnight. The walk with the dogs was a car ride to a park, then I drove over to see if I could find the place where she said she worked. I stopped at the store and came home. The other roommate was in his room. He said he heard her son when I asked him how she got her bed out. So, I was gone for about an hour.

LoL at you. Believe me, I would not type all this out with my tired fingers to amuse you, poster.

None of it makes any sense... - mmmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
She has a job, she doesn't have a job, I know where she works. Oh wait, now I have another roommate. The room was fully furnished, but she moved a bed out (her bed). This ominous imaginary woman must have been heck to deal with!

and the LoL at you comment really shows lack - of maturity

[ In Reply To ..]
might as well have said nananabooboo, you can't get me.

If there are holes in the drawers and the other roommate was home, did he or did he not hear the banging. Were pictures taken? Was the police called to file a report? I think the imaginary roomie nailed it when she thought this person was psycho.

Oh, come ON! OPs story only changed because the - renters story kept changing. nm

[ In Reply To ..]
x

About whether or not there is another roommate? - mmmmm

[ In Reply To ..]
Or whether the bedroom was fully furnished? What does the renter have to do with that?

She lost me right from the start - mtmt

[ In Reply To ..]
When she was upset about the roommate making a pot of coffee in the morning (gasp!), worried that coffee pot would break. What? Story sounded whacked right from the start.

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